Move to Rules! - How much time passes during round?

[CombatWombat51]

Ok, stay with me. I know a round is 6 seconds. I know a minute is 10 rounds. But, how much time does an actual round take up? Let me try an example to explain myself.

Norman goes on 16
Kyus goes on 12
Goblins go on 9

Norman takes his actions.
Kyus takes his actions.
The goblins take their actions.
It's Norman's turn again, and one round has passed. 6 seconds, correct?

So, how long did it take Norman to take his actions? It couldn't have been a whole 6 seconds because Kyus and the goblins also had actions. That would have made the round 18 seconds...

So, like, I don't get it. It seemed crystal clear to me from the day 3.0 came out, until about an hour ago.

Someone please help my muddled mind!

 

[randomling]

A combat round lasts 6 seconds.

I tend to rationalize it like this:

In the game-world, Norman, Kyus and the goblins all take their actions at the same time, with perhaps millisecond differences, because Norman reacts a bit faster than Kyus, who in turn reacts a bit faster than the goblins (Initiative checks).

Over here in the real world, though, it's logistically almost impossible to resolve all those actions at the same time, so we resolve them in order of Initiative check.

So if on Initiative count 18, Norman full-attacks the goblin, and on Initiative count 6 the goblin double-moves away, we can say that instead of the full-attack happening (6 seconds) followed by the goblin's move (6 seconds) for a 12-second round, Norman reacted a little faster than the gobbo and managed to start attacking before the goblin started moving - the goblin's round started a few seconds later than Norman's.

That help?

 

[CombatWombat51]

Well, I can see that I'm trying to make things too complicated. I just need to suspend my disbelief at all the simultaneousness without simultaneous results.

My biggest problem with it is having lots of people in the initiative all doing tons of things, all at practically the same time. If you had 12 combatants, they'd each get half a second to do all their stuff. I dunno, I guess 6 seconds can seem a bit cramped.

Anyone else have any thoughts to make me feel better? I think all this reading of my old 1E stuff has me longing for segments Not that segments were perfect either, or really even that different, but by using them, a much closer representation of simultaneous combat could be made, me thinks.

 

[Thanee]

It's abstract. Live with it!

It's also heroic. Even stuff a single high level character can do in one round is pretty ridiculous!

Bye
Thanee

 

[LightPhoenix]

Norman goes on 16
Kyus goes on 12
Goblins go on 9

Norman takes his actions.
Kyus takes his actions.
The goblins take their actions.
It's Norman's turn again, and one round has passed. 6 seconds, correct?

Correct, but not correct. Most actions take six seconds. So while six seconds has passed for Norman, not-six seconds has passed for Kyus, and won't pass until his turn. The (minor, IMO) problem with the abstraction is that technically Kyus and the goblins are still in the process of doing whatever when Norman gets to start his next action.

Note that you could figure out exactly how long after Normal goes that Kyus and the goblins do (Kyus at 1.5 seconds, goblins at 2.625 seconds) and thus how much time has passed at any single moment... but that's more trouble than I feel is worth.

 

[Prothall]

This usually doesn't bother me, but once it made the game seem particularly crazy... This instance being in The Speaker in Dreams, specifically in the *SPOILERS* attack by assassins in the backstreets *SPOILERS*. It's also a bit more of an issue now that the characters are routinely fighting CR 15 baddies, but since every fight takes between 2 - 5 rounds, it's not so bad, especially since noone has Leadership anymore.

The character with Leadership (the original sort) was so obscenely powerful the munchkin who ran him willingly retired the character.

 

[S'mon]

In theory a round takees 6 seconds.

In actuality, each character gets 6 seconds' of _action_ time themselves (on their Initiative) and then gets X amount of "ignored" time (on later Initiatives) to see what everyone else is doing, with X dependent on the number of other actors in the battle. Hence larger battles 'feel' much longer than the amount of time they're 'supposed' to take. AD&D's 1-minute rounds were much more plausible, in that sense.

If one wanted to houserule it, you could say a round was 6 seconds of 'action' & 6 seconds of 'reaction', roughly a 12 second round that is still too short but certainly more plausible. I just might do that myself...

 

[Thanee]

A german RPG has some neat optional rules to be used in situations, where the abstract combat round system does not really work well (especially the movement issues, when you get all your movement in a "split-second" and stand still the rest of the round).

It's called something like (roughly translated) critical action sequences and splits actions (but most relevant: movement) into sub-actions of one second each (combat round is 10 seconds there), it also includes reaction time, so you cannot simply start at the first second, but might be delayed somewhat (basically being "flat-footed"). It's a lot more complex and complicated, but allows to see - for example - if someone is quick enough to reach the guy before the coup de grace can happen or a spell is completed, or something like that. It's only meant to be used in such circumstances, where the abstract nature of the combat system seems to not cover the situation well enough.

That's really quite handy sometimes.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Prothall]

What RPG is that, Thanee? Would it be "Das Schwarze Auge"? I believe they released an english version of that...

 

[CombatWombat51]

What RPG is that, Thanee? Would it be "Das Scwarze Auge"? I believe they released an english version of that...

I'd like to know more about that, too. I was thinking about a system using segments and recovery times and that type of thing, even though I'd likely never use it. Might be fun for some brain exercise.