Multiple arms and LA

[evildm]

I was considering making a Tiefling descended from a Marilith with 4 arms, but I can't find any information in Savage Species on whether having 4 arms is worth an additional LA +1. Am I missing something or should it just not be worth anything special? What do you think?

EDIT: Changed message icon.

 

[gfunk]

I think if you plan to use them in a combat role that the LA should be at least +1, possibly +2.

At 1st level, they seem pretty weak but with the appropriate feat chain they could be quite powerful.

For instance multi-attack and multi-weapon fighting could make you a melee beast.

 

[evildm]

I think if you plan to use them in a combat role that the LA should be at least +1, possibly +2.

At 1st level, they seem pretty weak but with the appropriate feat chain they could be quite powerful.

For instance multi-attack and multi-weapon fighting could make you a melee beast.

Yeah, I'm leaning towards an overall LA +2 for a rogue character as opposed to an LA +3 overall. If the character had a natural attack for each hand, then it would definitely up it a bit as they would be eligible for Multiattack.

 

[SimonMoon5]

Imho, feats like Multidexterity (probably doesn't exist in 3.5) and Multi-Weapon Fighting can make multiple arms into a pretty amazing combat advantage. Oh, and also Improved Multi-Weapon Fighting to get tons of extra attacks.

At the very least, I would think through the LA like this:

* two extra arms gives two extra attacks (with feats). Extra attacks normally occur as a result of having a high BAB. Adding +5 BAB only gives one extra attack. At a minimum, +5 BAB would require 5 levels, and isn't as good as the attacks from extra arms, which get to use the highest BAB. On the other hand, taking 5 levels of fighter would give various other advantages (HD, BAB, saves, and technically skill points). So, that balances out somewhat, but the fighter levels are probably still slightly better. Thus, I'd drop the LA from +5 to about +4.

 

[Nail]

Make a poll! See how we vote!

I vote LA +3, even for the rogue.

 

[evildm]

Make a poll! See how we vote!

I vote LA +3, even for the rogue.

I can't, it won't let me change it. But I might start another topic with a poll. It's a good suggestion.

 

[evildm]

Oh, and another thing that I just remembered is that there's the Insectile template in Savage Species that's listed as LA +2, and it's got 6 arms. Beyond that, it also has a few abilities: climb speed, natural armor, tremorsense, wide vision, and unbalanced ability scores.

So that makes me wonder if giving a 4-armed character an LA of +4 or higher might be too much. What do you think?

 

[Nail]

I don't have Sav. Sp., so I can't comment on that. I've heard from some others that some of them are....how can I put this...."whacked".

I guess, thinking it through, the LA for a 4-armed character, with no other benefits other than 4 arms, might be as low as LA +1. Perhaps +2 LA, just to be safe. (Again: with no other benefits.)

Doesn't this depend on whether or not you'll allow the multiattack feat? If you do (and I can't see how you wouldn't, then this would be a melee monster, no question about it.

What about 2 Greatswords? Would this 4 armed monster get 1.5x Str bonus?

 

[evildm]

I don't have Sav. Sp., so I can't comment on that. I've heard from some others that some of them are....how can I put this...."whacked".

I guess, thinking it through, the LA for a 4-armed character, with no other benefits other than 4 arms, might be as low as LA +1. Perhaps +2 LA, just to be safe. (Again: with no other benefits.)

Doesn't this depend on whether or not you'll allow the multiattack feat? If you do (and I can't see how you wouldn't, then this would be a melee monster, no question about it.

What about 2 Greatswords? Would this 4 armed monster get 1.5x Str bonus?

The attacks need to be natural attacks to be eligible for Multiattack, so that doesn't apply to this particular situation.

A 4-armed character would indeed be able to use 2 greatswords, but would only get 1.5x str mod on the first sword, and then 1/2x str mod on the second (off-hands). Alternatively, the character could use all four hands to swing the sword, in which case they get 2.5x str mod.

Also, there's the Thri-Kreen which is ECL 3 (LA +1, 2 HD), which is eligible for both Multiattack and Multiweapon fighting, and gets a few special abilities: Poison, Psionics, Immunity to Sleep, Leap, a minor skill bonus, and weapon familiarity.

I'm thinking that just 4-arms on their own, without special abilities and whatnot is probably worth an LA +2. LA +1 seems a bit low, I think. So in this particular case, the Tiefling would be a total LA +3, ECL 4 (with 1 class level). Still not completely certain though, so any input is appreciated.

 

[ElMorte]

What about the Sahuagin in Savage Species (Page 12).

There is a normal one (at ECL 4) and one with four arms (at ECL 5).

So i would say the ECL for four arms is +1.