My player is squishing everything.

OTOH, Dragons can break their fall with their wings, thus avoiding injuring themselves...

BTW...
Does he hum, sing or recite "I'm not a playa, I just crush a lot" when he does this?
 
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Piratecat said:
I suggest you let him try this technique onto an enemy standing on ice. He hits, they both go through, and now he's underwater and suffering cold damage while trying not to drown. It'll make the encounter more exciting!

Od course, that should be cold, running water underneath the ice, so he is swept away from the hole. Being unable to move, and laden down with equipment.... I can't see the other party members finding him in time.

As any ice diver will tell you, underwater, under ice, it is extremely easy to get disorientated, and be unable to find the hole. There is a very good reason why scuba divers under ice use a guiderope leading to the surface hole.
 

King-Panda said:
The boots in question aren't those ones irdeggman: they aren't the ones with 5 charges that allow you to move 20, 40, or 60 feet (these are a standard action to activate). They are the ones that allow you to teleport 20 ft. 5/day (as a move action).

Pg 94 Dimension Stride Boots.

{You can use charges to teleport - 1 for 20 ft, 3 for 40 ft and 5 for 60 ft}

That is the correct item is it not?

Activation: - and standard (command)

The "-" applies to the competance bonus on jump checks which is a continuous effect and requires no activation.

To activate charges requires a command word (and thus a standard action).

Between this and the specification on only bringing objects up to your max load being clearly spelled out - I think you need to read the item description much more clearly before making rules governing them - especially for such uncommon items.

Regarding the pit trap, you get a reflex save to avoid falling into a pit trap. You don't automatically fall into one every time you step onto one. I can see what you are saying, and I like the idea of how you run time in combat, but it doesn't really make any sense to me.

Well traps also have their own "initiative" roll, especially for attacking one and that helps in how things are done.

I understand everyone goes in the same 6 seconds, But it's not really how combat in D&D works out. You'd really have to make everyone take their turns at the same time for it to work out that way. Everyone would have to move their minis (including all the monsters and NPCs) at the exact same time, probably stopping every 5 feet to adjust their angle, which would horribly slow down gameplay. I don't even wanna think about standard actions at the same time.

Which was th point I was trying to make - that movement is not simultaneous and all of your movement is resolved on your turn in the initiative round.

Let's say, outside of combat, a character in the front of marching order randomly takes off ahead of his group, using a move action to move 20 feet down a hallway, and 10 feet around a corner, activating a pit trap. From how I understand what you said, by your rules everyone would get a chance to run up to him and try and catch him before he falls, or if not, he would still get a chance next round (?) to cast feather fall? But if he ran around the same corner, and nothing happened, no one would care as much, and probably wouldn't race ahead with him, therefore changing their actions. You would have to keep the knowledge of what happened to the character around the corner secret from the rest of the group for them to not meta game.

Not technically allowed - since "actions" as in move, standard, etc. do not exist outside of the combat round. That is the other thing that causes "problems" since technically everyone is flat footed until their turn in the initiative order.

Now, lets say the first person in marching order doesn't take off, and is 5 feet away from the person behind him in line. They are marching along, and he steps on a pit trap. I'd give him a reflex save, and the person behind him a dexterity check to try and catch him.

Back to my point about traps having their own spot in the initiative order and being flat footed.

How can a character act if he is flat footed?

Trap went off in "surprise round" character missed his Spot check to notice it so was surprised.

Anyways, I feel bad about arguing with you; your way probably makes more sense than normal, and I'm just not seeing it. Thanks for all the help you've given though, I appreciate it.

It is not really deviating from "normal" since the normal you are infereing doesn't really "exist" per the RAW and is up to DM interpretation to apply in the first place - I am just trying to apply a consistancy across similar situations that allows for the way things work per the rules (like immediate actions).
 

In reference to turn order, moving, initiative, pit traps, and all that jazz we've been discussing, I'm going to have to concede. Just not making sense to me :p. No biggy, I agree it is all up to DM interpretation, and we'll just leave it at that :).

I apologize, they are not dimension stride boots. I think they are called something like boots of the unyielding journey/stride, or something similar. They get 5 uses a day to move 20 feet as a move action. I believe they cost 6000 or 8000 gp (unless the dimension stride boots cost 6000/8000, then they are 2000 gp; I know one of them is 6000/8000 and one is 2000).
 

Elethiomel said:
Also, note that a Large version of an item isn't simply that same item multiplied in all directions. As you can see from your Enlarge example, that would make armour for large creatures prohibitively heavy. Do not multiply the weight of all gear by 8: rather have the player check all the appropriate item tables to see what a Large version of his gear weighs.
Doing so would suggest that enlargeperson doesn't just simply "enlarge" someone, it re-engineers all their armor and items to be as if designed for a size category larger. 8x makes sense, anything less than that does not. If anything, I doubt that even a redesigned armor would be only 2x as heavy - after all, surface area increases by a factor of four.

As to the game balance aspect of avoiding a "hold person" effect when used as a hostile action:
hold person is a second level spell. Enlarge person first. However, it only works in this negative fashion if the person has a very high load beforehand (an unlikely situation). It also requires a full-round casting time. Finally, it doesn't paralyze someone or render them helpless - just too bogged down to move; they could still drop items, and could probably still cast spells (unlike hold person). Enlarge person isn't going to replace hold person anytime soon.
 

King-Panda said:
I apologize, they are not dimension stride boots. I think they are called something like boots of the unyielding journey/stride, or something similar. They get 5 uses a day to move 20 feet as a move action. I believe they cost 6000 or 8000 gp (unless the dimension stride boots cost 6000/8000, then they are 2000 gp; I know one of them is 6000/8000 and one is 2000).


Ahh boots of swift passage - an entirely different items with at least one similar effect.

It is a move action to teleport 20 ft but the description still contains the same text as the other on load limit though.
 

eamon said:
Doing so would suggest that enlargeperson doesn't just simply "enlarge" someone, it re-engineers all their armor and items to be as if designed for a size category larger. 8x makes sense, anything less than that does not. If anything, I doubt that even a redesigned armor would be only 2x as heavy - after all, surface area increases by a factor of four.

It's MAGIC. "Making sense" has got nothin' to do wit' it. :lol:

That said, the spell specificly states that equipment is enlarged "similarly" to how the creature is enlarged, so we can assume that's "multiplying its weight by 8".
 

King-Panda said:
He himself, his body, weighs 265 lbs.
How does this happen? This is the first thing that struck me as wrong. If dwarves aren't supposed to be any heavier than humans, who max out at 250#, how/why is he so heavy without other adjustments?
Given this, he cannot move (4160 compared to a max load of 1400), but he happens to have a pair of boots from the MIC that give him the ability to teleport 20 ft., 5 times a day as a move action(I think they are called dimension stride boots).
As suggested by others if it works anything like teleport you can't teleport into thin air - you have to have a solid surface/etc. as a destination.
So, he teleports above the enemy, at least 10 feet to get in the falling damage.
A clever idea but how does he manage to be accurate with this attack? Even dropping a rock a paltry 10' onto someone's head requires an attack roll. As I read the description here he just teleports, automatically does damage, and then does it again.
He also says he wouldn't take the 20d6 damage, or at least not all of it, because most of the weight is from his shield, his weapon, and his armor (of which only half or so is landing on him if he lands horizontally).
In that much he's correct. Falling damage has no adjustment for BEING a dead-weight, or for being insanely encumbered with weight. Since he's appearing in mid-air he should at WORST take 1d6 for falling 10'. BTW, do any of his opponents carry spears to set against his fall? THAT might do abnormally spectacular damage to him.
Is this legal? I thought it was funny the first time, but now he's doing it against anyone he thinks would squish well. Any help on the issue is appreciated.
It is funny, and not without creativity. But One-Note-Johnny tricks like this get old fast, and as seen they are often based on mis-interpretations or overly liberal interpretations of rules, the willingness to abuse them, and a DM who lets it go too far/too long. Inform the player that you have issues with it, but it IS an amusing stunt that gives the character a rather unique identity. Work with him to bring things back into line to where it's not such an overwhelming attack that it is an overly common form of attack or used for one-hit kills and other abuses (and he SHOULD still need to HIT no matter what other changes you do/don't make). If he won't cooperate, dictate.
 
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Nail said:
It's MAGIC. "Making sense" has got nothin' to do wit' it. :lol:

That said, the spell specificly states that equipment is enlarged "similarly" to how the creature is enlarged, so we can assume that's "multiplying its weight by 8".


Or you can assume that it means they go up a size category.

All equipment worn or carried by a creature is similarly enlarged by the spell. Melee and projectile weapons affected by this spell deal more damage.


Does this mean they likewise deal 8x damage? Since that is "similarly" also.

Weapons and armor have specific rules for wgt based on size category. Creatures on the other hand do not have as detailed a list - those are mostly up to things like the spell description.

SIZE INCREASES
A creature may become larger when its Hit Dice are increased (the new size is noted parenthetically in the monster’s Advancement entry).

A size increase affects any special ability the creature has that is affected by size. Increased size also affects a creature’s ability scores, AC, attack bonuses, and damage values as indicated on the tables below.

The tables do not address wgt at all.
 

Man WT Funny Hat: Thanks for all the input, I'll go down the list.

Honestly, if a player wants to be 265 lbs with a medium-sized race, I see no reason to stop him. I routinely see people in real life out on the street that weigh more than that. And seeing as how he's a dwarf, 265 is really not that big of a stretch if he's ripped.

Yeah, teleporting "requiring a surface" pretty much ended this tactic. Thanks for the extra voice on the matter.

I didn't really think too much about accuracy. He takes up 4 squares of space (Large), and he only needs to hit a guy in one (medium enemy). Wearing mountain plate with a tower shield, he's about the equivalent of a grinning, falling ceiling. I would require him to make a grapple check if he's trying to grab the enemy as he falls on them, otherwise they would get a reflex save to move out from under him. I wouldn't let him make an attack roll though, purely because I don't think he would have that much control over the situation. But it's all moot really, seeing as how he can't teleport into mid-air anyways.

As for him taking damage, I'm considering a house rule of anyone falling taking a 1/4th or a 1/3rd of the weight of their gear in extra falling damage, to simulate stuff your wearing "crushing" you. Any thoughts on that?

For the last bit, he's really not much of a problem player. Just a power gamer, which I can deal with. I LOVE the idea of setting a spear against his fall. That would suck for him.
 

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