My poor ickle dwagon!

[Eccles]

(I couldn't resist using the Dragon Icon - sorry!)

I just ran a fight as part of the City of the Spider Queen series against a dragon. The party was terrified, but 9 tanglefoot bags later, and the fight was a total pushover. No adventuring group should get a Coup de Grace against a dragon on full hit points.

This was worrying to me.

Anyone got any comments, sympathies, or whatever?

 

[Goobermunch]

(I couldn't resist using the Dragon Icon - sorry!)

I just ran a fight as part of the City of the Spider Queen series against a dragon. The party was terrified, but 9 tanglefoot bags later, and the fight was a total pushover. No adventuring group should get a Coup de Grace against a dragon on full hit points.

This was worrying to me.

Anyone got any comments, sympathies, or whatever?

Entangled is not equal to helpless. The party should not have been able to execute a coup de grace against the dragon.

--G

 

[Mytholder]

I share your pain.

Last night, I threw a CR12 red dragon up against my CR9 party. It was supposed to be a foreshadowing encounter - the dragon had 200+ hit points, so it was supposed to fight them for two rounds tops before retreating if they engaged it at all. It was really there just to show them that the later parts of the Temple of Elemental Evil were tougher.

Bloody paladin criticals twice with his two-handed sword and kicks out 100+ damage in one round on my poor dragon. Then the wizard casually mentions he has a cone of cold prepped....

 

[Eccles]

Entangled is not equal to helpless. The party should not have been able to execute a coup de grace against the dragon.

--G

Dex 0 after 3 bags connected made him pretty helpless...

 

[nsruf]

Dex 0 after 3 bags connected made him pretty helpless...

Eek! Entangled is a condition - either you have it or you don't, you can't be entangled multiple times. Granted, some conditions get worse if you acquire them more than once (fatigued, shaken, etc.) but not entangled.

Poor dragon

 

[Tars Tarkus]

The Dragon should not have been effected by the tanglefoot bag if it was Huge or better.

Tanglefoot Bag: When you throw a tanglefoot bag at a creature (as a ranged touch attack with a range increment of 10 feet), the bag comes apart and the goo bursts out, entangling the target and then becoming tough and resilient upon exposure to air. An entangled creature takes a –2 penalty on attack rolls and a –4 penalty to Dexterity and must make a DC 15 Reflex save or be glued to the floor, unable to move. Even on a successful save, it can move only at half speed. Huge or larger creatures are unaffected by a tanglefoot bag. A flying creature is not stuck to the floor, but it must make a DC 15 Reflex save or be unable to fly (assuming it uses its wings to fly) and fall to the ground. A tanglefoot bag does not function underwater.

 

[Eccles]

Sadly, it wasn't huge. I don't think.

As I recall, it was large. But I could've been wrong.

Anyway, having just checked, the 3.0 SRD doesn't have the same limits. 10 minute maximum, and you can goo up the damn tarrasque if the mood takes you.

The point about being entangled once only is a good one, though. It's a shame the book's not more explicit on these fairly critical points!!

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

I guess the next dragon could get an oversized tanglefoot bag, just to drop on pesky adventurers?

 

[Ferret]

Did it happen all on the PCs rounds? Or did the dragon get goes inbetween? If thw latter is true it should have flown, or attacked the tangler, or destroyed the webbing with a breathweapon or.............

What dragon was it?

 

[Altamont Ravenard]

Did it happen all on the PCs rounds? Or did the dragon get goes inbetween? If thw latter is true it should have flown, or attacked the tangler, or destroyed the webbing with a breathweapon or.............

What dragon was it?

yesss... share... let's see what you did wrong, so that we can deem you unworthy of DM'ing dragons... (and no, I'm not a member of BADD).

AR