D&D General My Problem(s) With Halflings, and How To Create Engaging/Interesting Fantasy Races

[DrunkonDuty]

Wow. 188 pages and still going. I didn't realise halflings were this interesting.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Wow. 188 pages and still going. I didn't realise halflings were this interesting.

It seems like you and some others…sold halflings short.

 

[Mecheon]

And no one else has proposed any changes at all.

I just want Halflings out of that 'These are the top 4 races you'll have". Just, make the races alphabetical

 

[Hussar]

Did you miss the 50-60 pages where we discussed Yondalla granting them favor and the discussing the difference between magic and Magic from the tweet?

Quite possibly. After the initial back and forth when none of my concerns were addressed, I figured I'd largely ignore the discussion and carry on. But, it is a really long thread.

So halflings. Please stop repeating this same lie, it has been debunked several times. By all the numbers we have available halflings are among the nine most popular races, so if popularity is the metric, they deserve their place in the PHB.

Either admit that you just hate them and want them gone for that reason, or admit that you were wrong about the numbers and they deserve to be in PHB. It is dishonest to try to pretend that your stance is based on data, when we all can plainly see that the data does not support your stance.

Wow, now I'm "lying"? But, "among the nine most popular races" isn't spinning things? How about, in the bottom ranks of the top nine races? Since we're being all "honest" and all.

But, no, I don't think ANYTHING that sits around the 5% (oh, sorry, either 5.9% or 4.7%, since we're being all honest) mark deserves to be in the PHB. But, you apparently are an expert mind reader who thinks it's because I "hate" halflings. Yay, take a drink folks, we've got another one!

You obviously draw your cut off line differently. That's fine. No worries. I draw mine at higher than a race that appears at about 1 in 4 tables, while the other 19 characters aren't. To me, the only reason halflings are as high as they are is because they appear in the PHB. If we moved them out and replaced them with something else, no matter what we replaced them with, they'd still hit that 5 (ish) percent mark. There's nothing special about halflings that makes them as popular as they are. They are only that popular because they appeal to tradition.

 

[Hussar]

Interesting. The last halfling player I had at my table was playing her very first game of D&D. And it was the race she chose.

Saying "people like it and it enables them to play the characters they want" is the literal opposite of an appeal to tradition.

Indeed in my experience halflings are great for slightly confused newbies. The "I'm out of my depth here and uncertain but I'm going to continue" (which isn't the same as a traumatic bad day but can overlap) underlying the halfling is a decent away of aligning what an uncertain newbie is feeling with what their character is feeling, making it easier to get into character.

Yes the "out of my depth in a D&D world" may be a common story but by the same token it will be the first time that person has experienced and got to put their spin on that story. Should we start burning books that have sold over a thousand copies and are out of copyright?

Ok, having complained repeatedly about other people not taking me at my word, I'd be foolish not to take you at yours. So, for you, it's 100% not an appeal to tradition.

So, with that in mind, you must obviously disagree with several of the things @Cadence posted. After all (bold mine to note the appeals to tradition:

• They're a small race without the baggage of being innately magical and like miniature elves
• (/snip for joke)
• They remind me of five of my favorite characters in fantasy literature
• They make great underdogs
• They make a great B&B theme This Airbnb Feels Like a Real-life Hobbit House Straight Out of Middle-earth — but It's Right Here in the U.S.
• They aren't over-used like elves and dwarves
• They aren't new fangled and un-D&D feeling (unless you liked 4th) like Tieflings and Dragonborn
• They weren't made to obviously suit the gods' needs
• One of my first pair of characters was a Halfling
• Moldvay thought they were worth an entire character class, and his version of the game was pretty boss
• They'll bean you with a sling stone in the noggin if you don't agree with my list
• Kender will hopefully be written out of Dragonlance

So, can you now take @Cadence to task for talking about the appeal of tradition in halflings? After all, you are dead set on insisting that the popularity of halflings has nothing whatsoever to do with tradition and he is very strongly contradicting you. One would wonder why you are so set on "proving" me wrong, yet allow others who directly contradict your points slide. It is also interesting that you would posrep a post you so strongly disagree with. After all, there's nothing about halflings that are supposed to appeal to tradition, yet, in a post that is full of appeals to tradition, you took the time to give it a thumbs up.

But when I say that the reason halflings are as popular as they are is because of tradition, I'm completely wrong.

I'll admit to a certain degree of confusion here.

 

[carkl3000]

So... it's bad that someone changes their mind when they get new data? Would you rather people stuck to their guns even when the data shows they're blatantly wrong?

Blatantly wrong? I think just how wrong I was is open to interpretation... but maybe I did overstate my case a little...

 

[Faolyn]

Blatantly wrong? I think just how wrong I was is open to interpretation... but maybe I did overstate my case a little...

I didn't mean you when I said blatantly.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I'm going to disagree here. Shock.

This is 100% an appeal to tradition and nothing else. Heck, even look at the lists of why people like halflings - Tolkien appears right there at the top of the list, as well as pointing to Moldvay Basic (the BEST version of D&D mind you), an edition that hasn't been in print for thirty years. And, no, they don't help players tell a different sort of story. They help players tell ONE story. The same story over and over and over again that was first told almost a hundred years ago now that they probably read in elementary school when they first got into the genre.

Now, I know there is zero chance of finding this one out, but, I wonder if there is an overlap between age and liking halflings. If there is any connection between when someone got into the hobby and their preference for maintaining halflings in the PHB. I know, that's just idle speculation.

Ah yes, the thing we like happens to be old so we must like it because tradition.

Never mind that some of us vehemently, and loudly (on these forums…frequently), despise traditionalism, and don’t think humans, clerics, or fighters, are a useful part of the game.

Weren’t you complaining at someone the other day because they “ascribed motives to people”?

You don’t see any hypocrisy in the post I’ve quoted here, and that complaint the other day?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

EVERY halfling PC character is "X was happy and content until"

False.

 

[carkl3000]

I didn't mean you when I said blatantly.

Oh, it's alright. I don't mind being wrong... once in a while...