My Wizard Build, suggestions?

[UngeheuerLich]

*snip*

good reasoning

so i have to reconsider.

Still i have a problem: small quarterstaffs are still needed... (or an errata which adds *small* to the staff implements at least)

 

[KarinsDad]

Where does it say they can't?

Rule: p158 Wizard Implements "A wizard wielding a magic orb, staff, or wand can add its enhancement bonus to the attack rolls and the damage rolls of wizard powers"
Rule: p215 Weapon Groups "Weapon groups are families of weapons that share certain properties. They’re wielded similarly and are equally suited to certain kinds of attacks. In game terms, some powers and feats work only when you’re attacking with a weapon in a specific group."
Rule: p216 Definition of Staff Weapon Group "Staff: In its most basic form, a staff is a long piece of wood or some other substance, roughly the same
diameter along its whole length."
Rule: p218 Weapon Chart showing what weapon group a quarterstaff is in "Quarterstaff ... Staff"

So, RAW the wizard may use a staff as an implement, and a quarterstaff most definitely is a staff.

This is a very liberal reading of RAW.

A "Staff Implement" can be used as a quarterstaff and its bonuses can be used for implement powers or melee attacks.

is not the same as

A "Quarterstaff Melee Weapon" is in the Staff weapon group and hence its bonuses can be used for implement powers or melee attacks.

In fact, you would be hard pressed to find a rule that says that a magical quarterstaff (e.g. a weapon like a +4 Cunning Staff) can be used for Wizard Implement powers. This is not true for such things as a longsword for a Wizard of the Spiral Tower where that ability is explicitly given.

I think Wizards have enough options without allowing them to use Cunning Weapons on their powers.

Either way, the text for wizards using the staff weapon group is the same text that swordmages use to be able to use any, say, heavy blade as their implement/weapon, so in order to claim it doesn't work by RAW, you're also effectively claiming that swordmages can't use longswords for their implement powers - only 'Heavy Sword Implements', of which none have been published.

The text is not the same.

Your blade adds its enhancement bonus to attack rolls and damage rolls and any extra damage granted by a property (if applicable) when used as an implement.

This indicates that the melee weapon can be used as an implement (although it does not give all of the properties of the weapon when used as an implement, only extra damage properties).

The quarterstaff text and the staff implement text do not indicate that a quarterstaff can be used as an implement. Otherwise, the discussion would be moot. Your interpretation is derived from a bunch of rules because the text is insufficient.


Although WotC appears to be setting direction for this, I do not think that deriving rule x from 4 rules y should be the way to go.

 

[ppaladin123]

I didn't find "Disembodied hand" in AP. And second, the Spider helps me with my controlling. I'm quoting...

It's in the article on arcane familiars from last month's dragon magazine. You should check that article out.

 

[simen]

It's in the article on arcane familiars from last month's dragon magazine. You should check that article out.

We don't use Dragon magazines. Not yet anyway I don't see how that will save one feat anyway... Since you can only have one familiar and that spot is already taken. If not I could take "Disembodied Hand" (I found it's description online), but I still would have to use one feat in order to use a familiar

About the whole Staff thing... Read it all before, and neither me or my DM are convinced that a magic Quarterstaff can function as a Staff Implement. But that day that is allowed through a FAQ or anything I'll just retrain the feat and use a Staff instead

Re: KarinsDad

It's RAW. It been known for a very long time and Wotc have had a good time "fixing" this if they meant it was broken. We have decided to follow the rules (RAW)... If our DM suddendly start "that's OP, not legal" most of the players would probably stop playing. There are a lot of other good powers and synergies besides negative saving throws... The alternative is a boring game where all the powers do are damage and effects that end the next turn (like encounter powers most). So we are counting on Wotc to moderate us, even though they do a bad job at times they atleast are not taking "sides" and are somewhat neutral and everyone in my party follows and respect their rulings. At that topic, atleast I didn't take "Divine Oracle" PP and I only start with wis 14.

Edit: Anyway. What do you think about these stats?

str: 8
con: 13
dex: 15
int: 18
wis: 14
cha: 12

Yeah, I now odd numbers sucks but hear me out. I don't need higher wisdom than 20, so at 24 and 28 I can get dex/con even

The question is. Wand or Staff? Or none? A wand could save me a daily magic item use, and with "Keeper's Prescience" (lvl 24) it would even be better... And do I even have to mention "Trick of Knowledge" which gives me +2 to attack (with my arcane bonus it does easily), and being invisible with "Vanishing Act" I get CA to. That's a nice odd of hitting, both to all and solo (wand). What do you think?

 

[KarinsDad]

About the whole Staff thing... Read it all before, and neither me or my DM are convinced that a magic Quarterstaff can function as a Staff Implement. But that day that is allowed through a FAQ or anything I'll just retrain the feat and use a Staff instead

Well, Character Builder does allow it.

The problem is that WotC is making decisions on the rules and adding new rules, but they are doing it through Character Builder and the Compendium and not in the Errata which I personally think sucks.

The alternative is a boring game where all the powers do are damage and effects that end the next turn (like encounter powers most).

The game is boring without the big reset button of "I win, the solo auto-loses"? Odd, but play the game however you want.

Edit: Anyway. What do you think about these stats?

They are fine. A lot of players in our game have odd stats. It allows for some builds without always pushing to the next even ability score.

The question is. Wand or Staff? Or none? A wand could save me a daily magic item use, and with "Keeper's Prescience" (lvl 24) it would even be better... And do I even have to mention "Trick of Knowledge" which gives me +2 to attack (with my arcane bonus it does easily), and being invisible with "Vanishing Act" I get CA to. That's a nice odd of hitting, both to all and solo (wand). What do you think?

Tome.

 

[Hereticus]

My Wizard Build, suggestions?

I would go about building a character in a completely different way... and perhaps we would have ended up with the exact same build.

First what this build is about.

- It's first role is a controller.

- The second is as an all knowing and being a utility wizard.

- And last he is a minor leader and I try to boost damage a little to.

- I have choose Eladrin as my race.

Your character background consists of four short sentences, and it tells me almost nothing, other than how you want to fight in combat.

Before I construct a character, especially one that I plan to bring from first to 30th level, I go into alot of depth on it background. Once I have a personality and history worked out, then I start choosing feats and powers that match what I've described.

Role playing to me is about much more than a list of stats and abilities, and a kill list.

 

[Hereticus]

All knowing? Than take jack of all trades, one of the best feats in the game imo.

I have training in 7 of 17 feats... I could pretty much not give a darn about the other 10. Sure they would be helpful, but I play my character to have weaknesses and vulnerabilities.

As an Eladrin (1) Wizard (4), I started with training in five skills:
- Arcana (my bread and butter skill)
- Religion (more for extra-planar knowledge)
- Nature / Dungeoneering (I can get by on my own, without food handouts)
- Perception (it's a nasty world, I need to see it before it sees me)

Background - Arcana (see above)

Then I selected with advancement:
- 01: Improved initiative (survival may depend on going first)
- 02: Skill Training - Insight (I mistrust 100% of all non-eladrin)
- 04/06: Astral Fire & Burning Blizzard (all my attacks are fire & ice by design)
- 08: Skill Training - Bluff (for Disguise), to be changed to multi-class Feylock
- 10: Skill Focus - Arcana (I rock with this skill)
- 11: Spell Focus (poor sucker victims of my spells)
- 12: Arcane Reach (I am a deceptive prick)

 

[Hereticus]

At-Will Powers:
- Magic Missile: to hit a target at 20.
- Scorching Burst: I like fire, and it does damage (range 10) on 3x3 squares.

Encounter Powers:
- Force Orb(1): Improved Magic Missile, damage (range 20) on 3x3 squares.
- Ice Rays(5): Cold damage (fire & ice thingy), can immobilize targets for Fighters to hack.
- Fire Burst(9): Fire damage, (range 20) on 5x5 squares.
- The One Sword(11): Weapon use is new for me.

Daily Powers:
- Flaming Sphere(1): Fire damage, I can move it between me and my enemies.
- Sleep(1): Even if it slows, battle is about mobility.
- Bigby's Icy Grasp(5): This is great, my favorite attack power.
- Fireball(5): I haven't used it yet, want to retrain.
- Mordenkainen's Sword(9): Good spell, but not my go-to power.
- Wall of Fire(9): I haven't used it yet, want to retrain.

Utility Powers:
- Fey Step(race): Best racial power, bar none.
- Feather Fall(2): a life saver.
- Shield(2): Saved me four times from hits as an interrupt, could have used it more.
- Disguise(6): Infiltration at its best, why I trained in Bluff skill.
- Invisibility(6): Saved our party from death twice, half the time I cast it on others.
- Arcane Gate(10): Great adventuring power, very helpful.
- Blur(10): Best defensive power, I stay five squares away and use Arcane Reach.
- Shape the Dream(12): Have not used yet, does not seem useful.

Next Encounter Power:
- Prismatic Burst(13): More for blinding than damage.

 

[simen]

Your character background consists of four short sentences, and it tells me almost nothing, other than how you want to fight in combat.

Actually I have a really long background story. But that is written i Norwegian...

Tome? Shouldn't I had pumped my con a little more then? And I don't like the summoning stuff i 4e. Use my own actions to control my summons? Don't like it

On "Jack of all trades". I have all the knowledge skills already. Arcana, Nature, Religion, Dungeoneering, History so I pretty much know as much as I can... And last I have Perception.

 

[Hereticus]

Actually I have a really long background story. But that is written in Norwegian...

I can sympathize with not wanting to translate. As a native English speaker I had role played in Spanish.

My wife is a native Hungarian speaker, and she speaks a second language everyday and at work.

The point being, as you have also taken, is that a build should be based on a background that evolves as the character develops, and skills and powers should be chosen based on background with an eye on effectiveness.