Need help from Planescape Fans Re: The Setting

[broghammerj]

After seeing several posts by Boz, I have rekindled an interest in Planescape. I've bounced around the idea of picking up some of the material for quite some time. When it was originally released I wasn't horribly thrilled with the setting idea and I was well entertained by Ravenloft and Darksun. As a result, I am very unfamiliar with the setting. I have a few questions that could help me with my decision.

1. Can low level characters play in planscape? I always pictured high level uber characters being involved in planar travel.

2. What book/books would you recommend me picking up? Obviously the boxed set would be helpful, but it can be expensive. Is there a book that could give me a taste of what it's like?

3. Is the setting and planes well detailed? I have a personal problem running games that are vague in nature. To give you an example...I loved the Alternity setting but found that writing adventures in space was difficult. One's point of reference is way out there. My creativity comes in the form of writing plots, NPC development, etc. I am a poor world builder. Describing a foreign planet got very burdensome. The planets lacked the details I felt they needed to be credible settings for adventure. I could foresee that being a similar problem in describing a plane. How does one characterize the abyss, a place of pure chaos and evil?

Thanks for the help.

 

[Crothian]

1) Yes, but it can be tough. You just have to set it up so the players can have low level adventures against easy opponents.

2) Well, manula of the planes gives a nice over view but if you want specifics the Box sets are really the way to go. But they can be hard to find and expensive unless you just want PDFs of them which are like 5 bucks a piece over at RPGNow. Actually that might be the way to go, I'm not sure how good the scans are but they are pretty cheap and should give you a great idea if you want to go after the physical copies.

3) Yes and no. THe planes are huge, so while there are sections that are nicely detailed there is a lot that is not.

 

[Tyler Do'Urden]

1) The original Planescape setting was designed to be played from 1st level, and it's not hard, if you remember an important rule:

Not all encounters have to end in bloodshed- for most encounters, there should be an alternative.

The Planescape setting is more about intrigue and philosophy than hack and slash. Diplomatic maneuvers, arguements about belief (and twists of logic), riddles, and roleplaying are all much more central to Planescape than they are to other settings. If you're running a traditional Planescape campaign, you'll probably want to have all your players choose factions to belong to (though be careful, some don't get along that well), and get them involved in the "cold war" between the factions as soon as possible. Set the first several levels in Sigil and the Outlands- don't go running off to the more dangerous planes just yet (though there's enough danger and adventure in Sigil and the Outlands to last any campaign to 20th level and beyond). The Abyss can wait until your PC's know a thing or two about their characters, their limitations, and the non hack n' slash nature of the campaign.

Now, in 3e, I'd recommend starting at 2nd level (to make working planetouched races, gith races, and bariaur, which are all ECL +1 and significant in the setting, into the game much simpler) and allowing Savage Species racial classes for people who want to play more offbeat characters. One of the fun elements of planescape is the fact that "Cantina Scene" parties, which I've ranted about elsewhere, are completely plausible and appropriate. If your players want to make a party consisting of a Mercykiller Illithid, a Sensate Pixie, a Doomguard Tiefling Wizard, and a Clueless Elven Psion, it's completely appropriate. The planes are high weirdness, where even such an odd group as this isn't the oddest group of bashers to ever wander the place. A party that I wouldn't allow in a million years in a Forgotten Realms or Midnight (or even Eberron) game, I'd allow in a heartbeat in Planescape, as long as the players can come up with a common reason for their characters to be together. The "infinity" of the planes makes it a fun place to experiment with classes, races, magic, etc. that you've wanted to try but never been able to work in elsewhere.

2) Get the boxed set- I think it's only $5 for the PDF on RPG now. As for 3e books, there are several that are helpful to have. Manual of the Planes is almost essential- it updates most of the planar mechanics to 3e, though it's not as complete as the Planescape materials were, it serves as a great quick reference guide to the planes (a must when your players wander off in an unexpected direction). Though the Planar Handbook has been lambasted by some on these boards, I'd say it's an important book for anyone trying to run a 3e Planescape campaign, and includes PC racial writeups for planetouched races (including several new ones, such as human/mephit hybrids, wildren, and others), new planar spells and modifications for planescape classes, faction-related prestige classes, lots of useful planar sites, CR-tables for planar encounters, and writeups on several planar cities. The only problem with it is that it's written for the post-Faction War era, which means that not everything in there (especially regarding the factions!) will match up with the 2e info. Savage Species, while not an absolute must, is fun to have for players who want to try their hands at playing powerful outsiders or monsters not normally available in a typical D&D campaign, and can be very useful for designing interesting planar encounters. Lastly, the Fiend Folio deals almost entirely with extraplanar monsters.

As for 2e planescape materials, there are quite a few good books and boxed sets, most (if not all) available as PDF's:
-The "Planes" Sets (Planes of Law, Planes of Conflict, Planes of Chaos)- These contain further details of the outer planes, and have an abundance of information and adventure hooks in them.
-Hellbound: The Blood War boxed set
Not only does it contain useful information about the eternal war between the fiends (and many significant players and battlegrounds), it also contains three complete adventures.
-Uncaged: Faces of Sigil
An anthology of NPC's. Lots of interesting ideas in here.
-The Factol's Manifesto
Get the complete "dark" of the factions.
- A few of the adventures were quite good. Dead Gods, Tales from the Infinite Staircase, The Great Modron March, and The Deva Spark are all ones I'm fond of. I liked Faction War as well, but be careful how you use this one (if at all)- it changes the setting quite a bit.

There are also a few third party d20 supplements that are very useful for Planescape games:
-FFG's Planes and Portals
-FFG's Sorcery and Steam (if you want to playup the "steampunk" flavor hinted at in the Planescape books)
-FFG's Monster's Handbook (the best book around for creating balanced but bizzare creatures- great for modifying the flavor of your "typical" encounters)
-Malhavoc's Beyond Countless Doorways
-Necromancer's Tome of Horrors

Though, that said, just about anything can be worked into a Planescape game- the weirder and more out of place in a "conventional" setting, the better. Just about anything from Malhavoc or Green Ronin, for instance, would fit right in (as would most Eberron material, or Bastion Press' setting- both of which I've heard compared to Planescape).

3) Hmm, hard to say, then. Sigil is very well detailed, though the rest of the planes vary. Of course, most planescape campaigns tend to involve a lot of going directly from Sigil to a specific site and back, so having a lot of detail would probably be excessive. Again, you can use just about anything with planescape- and "vagueness" is part of the setting, as the whole idea of the outer planes is that they are products of dreams, thought, and belief, and hence vague and mutable. So, unlike the "concreteness" of a space setting (like Alternity Star*Drive), Planescape is intended to have more to do with imagination and dreams than anything else. (Which is why most 2e supplements and modules spent a lot more time on descriptions and characterizations than on game stats)...

All in all, it's worth checking out- it's still probably my favorite D&D setting, and I can't wait to run a 3e campaign (when I start my next one...)

 

[Ryltar]

re: 1)

You won't have a problem - as long as your players understand what they're dealing with. If they have to upset a hamatula on the streets of Sigil while being 1st level - well, tough luck. But if you make it clear to them that there are bigger fish than them, and that they cannot fight their way out of everything, you should be set to go. Just keep in mind: create small adventures at first - Sigil-based/ Faction-based, these are always good starts, and not much plane-hopping involved at this level.

re: 2)

Get the Boxed Set, get the Factol's Manifesto, and get Hellbound. That should cover all your basic PS needs - but you might also want to get the Planes of ... boxed sets for all the planesy goodness found within.

Also, check out Shemeska's Story Hour (to be found on these boards) - it is virtually unmatched in PS flavor, although it is a bit on the 'lothish side . Also, take a look at the excellent work done by the PS3e team at www.planewalker.com.

Oh, and ignore every single bit of fluff that's in the MotP or the Planar Handbook - that's just screed.

 

[Jupp]

I think Tyler Do'Urden gave you the most important tip when running a PS campaign:

"Not all encounters have to end in bloodshed- for most encounters, there should be an alternative.

The Planescape setting is more about intrigue and philosophy than hack and slash. Diplomatic maneuvers, arguements about belief (and twists of logic), riddles, and roleplaying are all much more central to Planescape than they are to other settings."

That said, it is not very hard at all to have 1st level players in a PS campaign. In fact, the PS setting is so diverse that it really shouldn't be a problem to create an interesting campaign/adventure for low level players. But the DM will probably have to prepare better for his game sessions than it would be the case for standard D&D settings like FR or Greyhawk. That's mainly because PS gives the players so much choices that the DM can run into a wall pretty fast if he is not prepared.

Perhaps to give the players some preparing time you could put the first adventure into a standard world like FR or Greyhawk and then transfer them to Sigil once they reach level 2 or 3. But while they go for level 2 or 3 in the standard world you could hand them out tidbits and some obscure knowledge about Planescape or Sigil and see how they react to it. Throwing the players into the PS setting without warning could be a bit harsh if they never played this kind of thing before because or if they are the from the kill-first-ask-later faction. Then this could be a very short trip to the multiverse

Generally I am a big fan of Planescape because it is pretty different to the other world setting that were released by TSR and it encourages actual roleplaying and thinking more than other settings.

For the module and accessories I would recommend things like:
- Planescape Campaign setting (obviously)
- Uncaged - Faces of Sigil
- Guide to the Cage
- Tales from the Infinite Staircase
- Factols Manifesto
- Planes of Law
- Planes of Chaos
- Blood War (with caution)

Some very nice adventures are (if you like pre-made campaigns)

- Dead Gods
- The Great Modron March
- Tales from the Infinite Staircase
- Eternal Boundaries
(all above are available at svgames as pdf)


I would go for the pre-Faction War time when playing a PS setting, especially when you play in Sigil. Later if you want you can still implement the Faction War/Blood War to give the players a big change in the setting. Also "Die Vecna Die" is an option but I wouldnt build that in too early because it is the start of a series of changes in the setting.

Happy Planescapin'

my 0.2 cents
Jupp

 

[random user]

If you are concerned about low levels and want your party to be fairly standardish, you can start them off in a random prime where perhaps the society has just advanced enough to know about planar travel and Sigil, or perhaps an advanced society who has been unable to find the portal between their prime and Sigil.

The party could be part of a nationwide hunt for the portal, with Willy Wonka "Golden Ticket" prizes (properly put into setting terms of course) awarded to anyone who finds the portal.

That would give you the ability to allow the party to mesh and get a few adventures under their belt before they are inundated with Sigil. (Of course if they don't bite on that plot hook you may be in trouble.)

On the other hand, part of the uniqueness of Planescape is allowing the myriad of races to play together, and if your players want to experience that, starting them in Sigil certainly is easily doable. It is, however, a lot of information to learn all at once (it would be hard to come up with a party full of planars who are clueless about the factions, for example), and your players may not be up for that.