New FAQ: Polymorph issues solved

[Voadam]

There are some crazy templates out there. Does "paragon" change creature type? How about "greater pseudonatural"?
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Paragon, no change to type.

PARAGON CREATURE
CREATING A PARAGON CREATURE
“Paragon” is a template that can be added to any creature (referred to hereafter as the base creature).
The base creature’s type remains unchanged. The paragon creature uses all the base creature’s statistics and special abilities except as noted here.
HD: A paragon creature always has maximum hit points. Paragon creatures also gain an additional 12 hit points per HD.
Speed: A paragon creature’s speed triples, for all movement types.
AC: Paragon creatures gain a +12 insight bonus to AC and a +12 luck bonus to AC. They also gain a +5 natural armor bonus (if the creature already has natural armor, use whichever is better).
Attacks: A paragon creature makes all its attacks with a +25 luck bonus on the attack roll.
Damage: A paragon creature gains a +20 luck bonus on Damage rolls for all melee and thrown ranged attacks.
Special Attacks: A paragon creature’s special attacks, if any, all gain a +13 insight bonus, if applicable. The +13 insight bonus may only be applied to a given special ability once.
Spell-Like Abilities (Sp) or Psionics (Sp): If the base creature has spell-like abilities, it gains +15 to its caster level to use those abilities. A paragon creature also gains the ability to use greater dispel magic, haste, and see invisibility three times per day, even if it did not have spell-like abilities before, at 15th caster level.
Special Qualities: A paragon creature retains all the special qualities of the base creature and also gains the following.
• Fire and cold resistance 10. If the creature already possesses such resistance, use whichever is better.
• Damage reduction 10/epic. If the creature already possesses Damage reduction, use whichever is better.
• Spell resistance equal to the paragon creature’s CR +25. If the creature already possesses spell resistance, use whichever is higher.
• Fast healing 20. If the creature already possesses fast healing, use whichever is better.
• A paragon creature’s natural weapons are treated as epic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Saves: The paragon creature gains a +10 insight bonus on all its saving throws.
Abilities: All ability scores are 15 points higher than those of the base creature.
Skills: The paragon creature gains a +10 competence bonus on all its skill checks.
Feats: Same as the base creature, plus one bonus feat.
Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground.
Organization: Same as the base creature.
Challenge Rating: As base creature +15.
Treasure: Standard for a creature of the adjusted CR.
Alignment: Same as the base creature.
Advancement: Same as the base creature.

Pseudonatural from the epic srd changes you to an extraplanar outsider:

CREATING A PSEUDONATURAL CREATURE
“Pseudonatural” is a template that can be added to any corporeal creature (referred to hereafter as the base creature).
Size and Type: The creature’s type changes to outsider (extraplanar). Do not recalculate base attack bonus, saves, or skill points. Size is unchanged.
HD: A pseudonatural creature always has maximum hit points.
Speed: A pseudonatural creature’s speed doubles, for all movement types.
AC: Pseudonatural creatures gain a +35 natural armor bonus. If the creature already has an armor bonus, use whichever is better.
Attack/Full Attack: A pseudonatural creature substitutes tentacle rake attacks for its melee attacks while in pseudonatural form. These tentacle attacks always use the creature’s best attack bonus. It also gains additional tentacle rake attacks (also at its best attack bonus) as noted on the table below.
Damage: Tentacle rakes from a pseudonatural creature deal Damage equal to 2d8 + Str modifier.
Special Attacks: A pseudonatural creature retains all the special attacks of the base creature and also gains the following.
Constant Insight (Su): The creature makes all its attacks with a +15 insight bonus. The creature is not affected by the miss chance that applies to attacks against a concealed target.
Improved Grab (Ex): If the creature hits an opponent smaller than it with a tentacle, it deals normal Damage and attempts to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity.
Rotting Constriction (Ex): Once the creature has hold of an opponent, each successful grapple check it makes during subsequent rounds permanently drains 2d4 points of Constitution. At the same time, the creature regains 10 lost hit points.
Spell-Like Abilities: At will—blur, dimension door, shield, unhallow. Caster level 20th. The DCs are Charisma-based.
Special Qualities: A pseudonatural creature retains all the special qualities of the base creature and also gains the following.
• Electricity and acid resistance of a varying amount related to its Hit Dice (see the table below). If the creature already possesses such resistance, use whichever is better.
• Damage reduction of a varying amount related to its Hit Dice (see the table below). If the creature already possesses Damage reduction, use whichever is better.
• Spell resistance equal to the creature’s HD x5. If the creature already possesses spell resistance, use whichever is higher.
• One extra tentacle rake attack (the creature can use another of its many tentacles to attack at no penalty while in pseudonatural form) for each 4 HD the creature has.
• A pseudonatural creature’s natural weapons are treated as epic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

Hit Dice Electricity and Acid Resistance Damage Reduction Extra Tentacle Rake Attacks
1–3 15 5/epic 1
4–7 20 5/epic 2
8–11 25 10/epic 3
12–15 30 10/epic 4
16–19 35 15/epic 5
21–24 40 15/epic 6
each 4 more HD +5 15/epic +1

If the creature already has one or more of these special qualities, use the better value.
Alternate Form (Su): At will, a pseudonatural creature can take the form of a grotesque, tentacled mass (or another appropriately gruesome form), but all its abilities remain unchanged despite the alien appearance. Changing shape is a standard action. Other creatures receive a –1 morale penalty on their attack rolls against pseudonatural creatures in this alternate form.
Saves: Same as the base creature.
Abilities: Increase from the base creature as follows: Str +22, Con +10, Dex +10, Wisdom +10, Intelligence at least 3.
Skills: Same as the base creature.
Feats: Same as the base creature.
Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground.
Organization: Same as the base creature.
Challenge Rating: Up to 6 HD, as base creature +16; 7 HD to 15 HD, as base creature +13; 16+ HD, as base creature +10
Treasure: Same as the base creature.
Alignment: Same as base creature.
Advancement: Same as the base creature.

 

[Hypersmurf]

From what I recall polymorphs main limitation is on hd.. so if one allowed templates it could get very insane, very quickly as most templates do not add hd, they add to CR or LA.

So, you could find the meanest creature of the highest hd you were allowed and then tack on a half dozen templates..

I started to note that the other main limitation is familiarity.

... but reading Alter Self and Polymorph, I can't find the restriction that you must be familiar with the form you want to assume. It's there for Shapechange.

I'm reading the SRD - is the familiarity clause in the PHB?

Please, note that bit:

for example, an elf
wizard can’t use alter self to become a half-dragon orc, since
that’s a dragon, not a humanoid)

This implies that an elf wizard could cast alter self to assume a humanoid form with a template that doesn't change his type.

No, it doesn't Because he states in the same paragraph that:

As always, you must still abide by the rules for the spell in question (for example, an elf wizard can’t use alter self to become a half-dragon orc, since that’s a dragon, not a humanoid).

And the rules for the spell in question (Alter Self) state:

You cannot take the form of any creature with a template, even if that template doesn’t change the creature type or subtype.

-Hyp.

 

[Len]

I started to note that the other main limitation is familiarity.

... but reading Alter Self and Polymorph, I can't find the restriction that you must be familiar with the form you want to assume. It's there for Shapechange.

I'm reading the SRD - is the familiarity clause in the PHB?

No. (At least I can't find it - those are some long spell descriptions.)
But it is a restriction for the druid's Wild Shape ability, which is based on Polymorph.

 

[Thanee]

I actually found the RotG article to be more sensible than the new FAQ.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Egres]

No, it doesn't Because he states in the same paragraph that:

As always, you must still abide by the rules for the spell in question (for example, an elf wizard can’t use alter self to become a half-dragon orc, since that’s a dragon, not a humanoid).

And the rules for the spell in question (Alter Self) state:

You cannot take the form of any creature with a template, even if that template doesn’t change the creature type or subtype.

-Hyp.

Right.

For this reason his statement is silly.

It's stating something like "Hypersmurf can't fly because he doesn't have the permission to do so."(not because he can't fly at all)

 

[Moon-Lancer]

I Still find these spells very upsetting, as I like playing druids.

This is what my dm did.


The type of the original creature does not change in wildshape (i am still unsure of this because basically I use exalted wildshape so she may allow it if I do not use exalted wildshape. ether way I’m not testing it as of yet.

using alter self or polymorph from a non human to a human does not grant you an extra feat, however if turning into a wolf with polymorph or wildshape would grant the bonus feat track, because the feat comes from a more physical aspect of the creature.

A human using wildshape keeps all his human stuff as well

Other player handbook races would keep their abilities but not ability adjustments

example. AN elf would keep the hidden doors ability, and their racial skill bonus. The animal they would be turning into would give them a circumstance bonus to skills, not a racial one.

in wildshape or polymorph, a creature keeps their old vision type but may also gain the vision type of the new creature.

A wildshaped elf (and other player handbook races) would keep their own mind and still be effected by hold person but not by hold animal.

no templits, or advanced creatures

creatures that have advancement charts are avalable like the hydra

abilitys gained from the new form use the old creatures hit dice and non physical stat to determin effect or dc.

example: Dragons Breath attack


That’s how we play. Allot harder to abuse and makes allot more sense. it really emphasizes that your barrowing a shape and emulating its ability.

 

[Jack Simth]

When my human is polymorphed* into another
creature, he loses any extraordinary special attacks and
qualities. Does this include his bonus feat and bonus skill
points? If so, how do I figure out which feat and skill points
are derived from his racial traits?

A human’s bonus feat and bonus skill points—like most
other racial traits—are considered extraordinary qualities, and
thus are lost when the character would lose such abilities
(including when polymorphed). This is a good reason to keep
track of which feat is your human bonus feat, since it might
have wide-reaching effects. (For instance, if Dodge was your
bonus feat, you’d lose the benefits of any other feats that have
Dodge as a prerequisite, such as Mobility and Spring Attack.)
Keeping track of where your bonus skill points are spent is
more onerous, and likely less significant to play. If most of
your skills are maxed out (that is, their rank equals your level
+3, or half that for a cross-class skill), it’s probably easiest
simply to designate one skill as the repository for all your
bonus skill points.
For ease of play, some DMs ignore this side effect, but
doing so represents a clear benefit granted to humans. Be aware
that players of nonhuman characters may resent this “freebie.”

Umm... wouldn't this kinda imply Shapechange becomes a bit more useful to a non-human than a human? Consider:

Elven Wizard Player: Nobody has ranks in Knoweledge(Schrodinger)? <sigh>
Player: Shapechange.
Player: I'm taking human, and, as those extra skill points are considered an Ex ability, I'm taking max ranks in Knoweledge(Schrodinger) for the duration.
Player: Now, with my int modifier of +10, that gives me.... a +30 to the roll. Ah, I get a feat, too! Skill Focus (Knoweledge(Schrodinger)), and now I have a +33! What was the DC on that again?
DM: 40.
Player: Great! As we aren't in combat at the moment, I'll take 10, please.

Umm.... Not In My Campaign.

 

[Dimwhit]

Umm... wouldn't this kinda imply Shapechange becomes a bit more useful to a non-human than a human? Consider:

Elven Wizard Player: Nobody has ranks in Knoweledge(Schrodinger)? <sigh>
Player: Shapechange.
Player: I'm taking human, and, as those extra skill points are considered an Ex ability, I'm taking max ranks in Knoweledge(Schrodinger) for the duration.
Player: Now, with my int modifier of +10, that gives me.... a +30 to the roll. Ah, I get a feat, too! Skill Focus (Knoweledge(Schrodinger)), and now I have a +33! What was the DC on that again?
DM: 40.
Player: Great! As we aren't in combat at the moment, I'll take 10, please.

Umm.... Not In My Campaign.

Not to comment on the rules allowing it or not, if you have a player do that, you need to put your DM's Guide to good use...and smack them over the head with it.

 

[Jack Simth]

Not to comment on the rules allowing it or not, if you have a player do that, you need to put your DM's Guide to good use...and smack them over the head with it.

Hence the "Not In My Campaign" comment. It is, however, a logical consequence of the spell's description and the FAQ's ruling.

Shapechange grants "all extraordinary and supernatural abilities (both attacks and qualities) of the assumed form". If a Human's bonus feat and bonus skill points are Ex qualities (as per the FAQ quotation), then they qualify to be gained (temporarily, and potentially differently each time) by Shapechange.

That is, however, utterly insane, so after acknologing the presence of that implication based on the FAQ's interpertation, I'm consciously deleting that aspect from any campaign I GM.

 

[Dimwhit]

That is, however, utterly insane, so after acknologing the presence of that implication based on the FAQ's interpertation, I'm consciously deleting that aspect from any campaign I GM.

Bah, I like my idea better. Don't even mention it in your campaign, then when a player tries it (or something similarly silly), smack him upside the head with the DM's Guide.

Edit: Or the Draconomican. It's also nice and heavy.