New PA podcast with some higher-level fighter details

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Here's the third Penny Arcade D&D Next podcast.

In it, they give away the current (as in, three weeks old) details for higher-level Slayer fighter abilities.

"Riposte" costs 3 dice to use, and it gives you a free attack when an enemy misses you in melee. This would be the level 7 ability. (I think they also implied you get 3 dice at level 6.)

"Whirlwind" is a level 9 ability that "if you hit a guy lets you spend your dice to attack other guys. Like if you're surrounded by orcs..." (I'm assuming this is like an improved cleave that costs more dice but lets you attack multiple enemies.)

A level 10 fighter gets 4d12 Combat Superiority dice. (!) Direct quote: "You're saying I can roll all these dice on one attack? What the ! Holy !... What this is, is Conan !"


Also, a tenth-level mook has about 30hp.

And there is/was a third rogue sheme called "charlatan" who could use magic items "like a 1st edition rogue." (Hopefully this was just left out of the playtest and not cut from the game.)

So we have confirmation that there ARE higher-level CS abilities that cost more than one die, and that CS dice scale up really quickly. (WTF do you get by 20th level?)

They also mentioned that warlords may be a class still, and implied that they may have access to the CS mechanic as well.

 

[Bow_Seat]

I just finished listening and I have to say that I really liked everything that I heard with one exception.

I'm not sure how I feel about warlords getting cs dice. It seemed like that thing that made the fighter unique. I'd hate to see that get picked up by other classes and start making the fighter less unique. Right now the fighter has two things going: CS dice are powerful and CS dice are unique. If they gave the dice to another class then even if the fighter were the best at using them it still wouldn't feel "special"

The rest of the podcast was absolutely awesome. I'm very excited.

 

[Bran Mak Morn]

I am excited as well, the CS mechanic looks more and more intersting and I imagine there could be tales about higher level fighters which goes like:
King Robert: We’re telling war stories. Who was your first kill, not counting old men?
Jaime Lannister: One of the outlaws in the Brotherhood.
Barristan Selmy: I was there that day. You were only a squire, 16 years old.
Jaime Lannister: You killed Simon Toyne with a counter riposte. Best move I ever saw.
Barristan Selmy: A good fighter, Toyne, but he lacked stamina.

 

[Raith5]

I just finished listening and I have to say that I really liked everything that I heard with one exception.

I'm not sure how I feel about warlords getting cs dice. It seemed like that thing that made the fighter unique. I'd hate to see that get picked up by other classes and start making the fighter less unique. Right now the fighter has two things going: CS dice are powerful and CS dice are unique. If they gave the dice to another class then even if the fighter were the best at using them it still wouldn't feel "special"

The rest of the podcast was absolutely awesome. I'm very excited.

I am mostly OK with the warlord and other martial classes getting expertise dice so long as they get less of them than the fighter. But I dont like the idea of warlord using expertise dice for warlord maneuvers - they really need to use another mechanic for this.

 

[Bow_Seat]

I am mostly OK with the warlord and other martial classes getting expertise dice so long as they get less of them than the fighter. But I dont like the idea of warlord using expertise dice for warlord maneuvers - they really need to use another mechanic for this.

This was my thinking when I first listened to the podcast, but then I asked myself "what would they use them on if not warlord maneuvers?" My answer to that was that they would just have a shorter list of possible fighter maneuvers, but this just feels like a half-fighter half-warlord.

If the warlord really is already going to have its own mechanic for its own maneuvers then why would they weaken the applicability of that mechanic so that the warlord could also be a half-fighter. If they do come up with a new warlord mechanic then they should go all the way. If they don't come up with a new warlord mechanic then they should get all the regular CS dice that a fighter gets, but have a completely different set of maneuvers in order to keep them differentiated.

tl;dr: they shouldn't half-ass it. go all one way or all another.

 

[GX.Sigma]

I am mostly OK with the warlord and other martial classes getting expertise dice so long as they get less of them than the fighter. But I dont like the idea of warlord using expertise dice for warlord maneuvers - they really need to use another mechanic for this.

I prefer the idea of the Fighter using expertise dice to use warlord maneuvers, if you see what I mean.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Perhaps the Warlord will get CS dice, but not a Fighting Style (or not as many Style abilities for the style he gets?). Instead of the parry option, he might have an inspiring option, where he uses his dice to inspire his allies (temp hps, or, for those who can stand it, even 'healing')? Same basic mechanic, but more options to buff allies with it, instead of pull cool manuevers or yourself.

I could see it.

But, I can also see the point that if they're making classes mechanically distinct, they might as well stick to it, and not make the Warlord any more fighter-y than the Paladin or Ranger or other melee-oriented classes.

 

[Raith5]

This was my thinking when I first listened to the podcast, but then I asked myself "what would they use them on if not warlord maneuvers?" My answer to that was that they would just have a shorter list of possible fighter maneuvers, but this just feels like a half-fighter half-warlord.

If the warlord really is already going to have its own mechanic for its own maneuvers then why would they weaken the applicability of that mechanic so that the warlord could also be a half-fighter. If they do come up with a new warlord mechanic then they should go all the way. If they don't come up with a new warlord mechanic then they should get all the regular CS dice that a fighter gets, but have a completely different set of maneuvers in order to keep them differentiated.

tl;dr: they shouldn't half-ass it. go all one way or all another.

Good point. I see what you mean and I was more than happy with the 4th ed idea of separate powers for everyone. I guess my thinking is that if the wizard and sorcerer share spells then martial characters can share maneuvers - in the DDN spirit of rationalization. But maybe different mechanics could power those maneuvers.

 

[variant]

It would be better to just make the warlord a part of the fighter than to have the expertise dice as a part of the warlord.

I am glad the rogue's sneak attack isn't actually done. I would like to see the return of the backstab.

 

[Chris_Nightwing]

I wish that one guy would stop swearing so much, it really detracts from the discussion.