New rituals!

[Incenjucar]

I agree that anything permanent needs to have a material cost. Small, temporary things, such as a Silence ritual, should have more temporary costs.

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My main thing with Arcana=Other Skill abilities is that there are a number of these now, such as Arcane Mutterings, and Arcana is extremely easy to pump into the stratosphere. A little is fine, but I don't want to see wizards being able to do everything with a single skill.

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Monsters are not known for their many high-end skills.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Am I missing something?

The rituals that can be "circumvented" (Alarm) have a DC that makes no sense when taken in context with the ritual.

DC = 10+ Skill Check modifier

For example, Alarm is a 1st level ritual. And requires no check. So a 1st level wizard's Alarm ritual at most will have a DC 15 (10 + Int Mod (+5)) to circumvent. Doesn't that seem like an extremely trivial DC?

A first level rogue trained in Stealth with maxed DEX will beat that DC on a roll of 5.

Am I reading this correctly?

... on a Stealth check (DC 10 + your Arcana check mod-
ifier) does not trigger the alarm.

It isn't INT mod, the ritual has a key skill of Arcana and as the quote above says the DC is 10 + Arcana. So for your average level 1 wizard the DC is probably more like 10 + INT (4) + TRAINING(5) and often another misc +2 you can get in various ways, so between 19 and 21 (and you can manage something a few points higher without a huge effort). The reason it is Arcana check modifier and not an actual Arcana check is that there are a lot of ways to crank checks that aren't modifiers (at least not permanent ones). Effectively it is "passive Arcana".

Your average rogue will have roughly the same Stealth bonus as the wizard at the same level, so you'd expect around a 50/50 chance to bypass. You'll probably keep out most ordinary Stealth bonus opponents a good bit of the time.

 

[TerraDave]

Details aside, I thought the article, and the fact that they did it, was mostly awesome.

 

[Ryujin]

It isn't INT mod, the ritual has a key skill of Arcana and as the quote above says the DC is 10 + Arcana. So for your average level 1 wizard the DC is probably more like 10 + INT (4) + TRAINING(5) and often another misc +2 you can get in various ways, so between 19 and 21 (and you can manage something a few points higher without a huge effort). The reason it is Arcana check modifier and not an actual Arcana check is that there are a lot of ways to crank checks that aren't modifiers (at least not permanent ones). Effectively it is "passive Arcana".

Your average rogue will have roughly the same Stealth bonus as the wizard at the same level, so you'd expect around a 50/50 chance to bypass. You'll probably keep out most ordinary Stealth bonus opponents a good bit of the time.

Would have been a 23 if set by my Eladrin Feylock, at 1st level. That's a pretty respectable number.

It also has to be located first.

 

[KidSnide]

My main thing with Arcana=Other Skill abilities is that there are a number of these now, such as Arcane Mutterings, and Arcana is extremely easy to pump into the stratosphere. A little is fine, but I don't want to see wizards being able to do everything with a single skill.

This is really part of a broader issue, in that the designers haven't really figured out how to deal with magic that duplicates skill abilities. If it's a bonus to skill abilities, than you need to adjust DCs on the basis that all PCs will have these bonuses. If it's a replacement for skill, then you end up with the super-arcana wizard who is just as good as (or better than) the other PCs in their areas of specialty.

I think the right answer is to make rituals orthogonal to skills whenever possible and have a downside. For example, rituals should provide effects like invisibility that makes it much easier to hide (since you are always concealed), but should still require a stealth roll to move around without being detected. A downside to invisibility could be that you are easily detected by wards designed to trigger when illusion magic enters the area. With a ritual like that, it becomes a meaningful and interesting choice about when to use the ritual and how. Of course, if rituals are going to be useful and powerful, there needs to be some sort of restriction to prevent everyone from taking all the best ones.

Giving magic a downside can be a little difficult (although money and healing surge costs help), but I think good general advice should be the magical wards and defenses should be better at detecting and stopping magic than they are at detecting and stopping extremely skilled non-magical individuals. For example, a charm might be really effective on your average orc or peasant, but would be chancier on a properly warded noble.

-KS

 

[UngeheuerLich]

There are some issues here though. Higher level divinations and wards for instance are QUITE powerful and would almost never be cast in an adventuring situation, which means effectively they're free. Just as a trivial example a character who knows Glyph of Warding and has the corresponding Warding Mastery ritual can simply fill their base of operations with limitless numbers of glyphs at a rate of one per day. They could do the same with many considerably more powerful existing rituals.

it is just, that the feat is broken, which allows to cast it without that cost, the rest is very good.
I also like, that many utility powers or cantrips are converted to rituals. So finally they don´t compete with combat bonuses anymore.
I hope we get some more of them (feather fall, expeditious retreat, invisiblity all come to my mind!)

 

[Tony Vargas]

I'm not especially comfortable with making Arcana increasingly the only skill a wizard ever needs to do anything,

It's an ongong trend, along with Wizards getting a sub-class and new powers in every suplement.

but it's great seeing the new quick-cast ritual scrolls and finally the death of "Rituals are being removed from the game!" claims.

Rituals that don't have a component cost and can be cast in combat aren't rituals, they're utility powers.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It's an ongong trend, along with Wizards getting a sub-class and new powers in every suplement.

Rituals that don't have a component cost and can be cast in combat aren't rituals, they're utility powers.

And this was a design mistake!

utility powers that have no real combat effect should have a component cost and should be rituals...

(actually I would not mind combat spells being cast from scrolls if a) th attack bonus is fixed as with alchemical items and b) it is as expensive as an alchemical item...)

 

[Klaus]

For example, rituals should provide effects like invisibility that makes it much easier to hide (since you are always concealed), but should still require a stealth roll to move around without being detected.

That is exactly how invisibility works. If you're invisible, you have total concealment from your foe (-5 to his attack), but unless you also make a Stealth check, he knows what square you're in.

 

[herrozerro]

Am I missing something?

The rituals that can be "circumvented" (Alarm) have a DC that makes no sense when taken in context with the ritual.

DC = 10+ Skill Check modifier

For example, Alarm is a 1st level ritual. And requires no check. So a 1st level wizard's Alarm ritual at most will have a DC 15 (10 + Int Mod (+5)) to circumvent. Doesn't that seem like an extremely trivial DC?

A first level rogue trained in Stealth with maxed DEX will beat that DC on a roll of 5.

Am I reading this correctly?

Actually a 1st level wizard would probably have a +10 Arcana mod because Arcana is a skill they get automatic training in.