non-PHB core classes which ones are good? which ones are bad?

[Li Shenron]

I am generally dubious about new classes.

[*]Mongoose's Chaos Mage - Another nice take on magic. Needs a little work (note: I have yet to get the quint book, so said work might already be done), but a fine concept.

I second the doubt myself, and I second the suggestion of Chaos Mage as one of the few (for the moment, I'd rather say the only...) extra core classes that I like. It is basically an alternative arcane spellcaster, with even more tactical flexibility of the sorcerer, but with no divinations, enchantments and many other effects. I tried it only as NPC so far because it is quite difficult to play IMHO.

 

[Felon]

Uhm... 12th level wings, IIRC. And natural flying works wonderfully in AMFs... see a certain storyhour for beholder use.

Nope, 17th level. Go check for yourself. And like I said, at 17th level, wings are a pretty moot asset as the ability to fly ain't hard to come by at all by then. Useful, yes. Rare, no.

And balanced? Balanced with a cleric (the utterly most broken class in the game, thank you).

Not much arguement there (did you not see my cleric comments regarding the healer? ).

The fact that the Favored Soul limits his selection of spells the same way a sorcerer makes a significant improvement in the balance area. If he's just going to cast the combat spells--Diven Favor, Divine Power, Righteous Might, etc.--then he's got to be fairly dedicated to doing that. He may not even have a single cure spell in his repetoire.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

I like the chananeler from "Midnight" myself.

 

[Psion]

For one thing, no details are provided on what the heck a hexblade is exactly, and the authors were really kidding themselves to think such details are unnecessary.

That's sort of what I was trying to say about the hexblade.

 

[Desdichado]

I think adding new core classes just to add them is usually a bad idea. On the other hand, the "D&D flavor" is heavily wrapped up in the core classes, and if you ever want to change it, it can be a bit difficult unless you have different ones.

So there's certainly a need for other base classes out there, but not just for anyone. I'm gearing up for a campaign that includes only the barbarian, rogue and fighter as core classes carried over from the PHB, so I'm quite glad to have other alternatives in print I can use to give more options. I'm taking some from Midnight, one or two from Arcana Unearthed, and a few other spots.

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

I'm a fan of the Unfettered and the Warmain from Arcana Unearthed... aside from the slightly odd names.

I think they're both a touch tougher than a single class fighter, but that's not a bad thing, if you ask me!

 

[Darklone]

Nope, 17th level. Go check for yourself. And like I said, at 17th level, wings are a pretty moot asset as the ability to fly ain't hard to come by at all by then. Useful, yes. Rare, no.

You're right, I'm stupid... About the flying: Sure it's easy to come by, but natural wings are lots better than anything else. No AMF or Dispel or Mord Dysj will shoot you down.

The fact that the Favored Soul limits his selection of spells the same way a sorcerer makes a significant improvement in the balance area. If he's just going to cast the combat spells--Diven Favor, Divine Power, Righteous Might, etc.--then he's got to be fairly dedicated to doing that. He may not even have a single cure spell in his repetoire.

I just had a problem that he knows two spells more per level than the sorcerer... to make up for the clerics domain spell and spontaneous curing. As if his extra saves and the Weapon bonus feats would not have been enough. But well.

Does anyone here think we are going to see a new D&D magic system in 4.0 ?

 

[Gundark]

well I started this thread but I didn't really give my picks.

Good:
Gun Mage- I kinda explained aloready why I liked this one. This class can be imported into a non-steamtech setting as well (a bowmage for example)

Hexer- I agree that nothing was given to why these guys exist. but I like the class.

Bad:
All 3 of the sorcery and steam classes, in addition to being a borderline crappy book it gave us 3 lousy core classes as well.

All of the mini handbook classes- I just don't see why you would have these.....they just are variants of existing classes.

Samuri & swashbucker- Well it has been said that QA did a better samuri and the swashbuckler....well it's too much like the duelist Prc.

Assassin- This core class is kinda broken ( it's death attacks are too good imo) plus I see it being a better Ppc than a core class. Btw this is just a rogue variant.

can't make comments on the others as I don't have the books

 

[Kae'Yoss]

I usually don't like adding core classes just because. You can go pretty far with just the 11 core classes. The Swashbuckler and Hexblade from are half decent, though (but I hadn't got a chance to see them in action).

I do like when they cut some classes and add new ones if the game style is different from Standard D&D, and when whole new mechanics are introduced:

The new Base Classes from Midnight are all nice IMO, and are necessary to cater to the different angle Midnight is taking on magic.

The Psionics Classes are necessary to introduce Psionics.

The Classes you find in Rokugan (and Oriental Adventures, though I don't use OA for anything but Rokugan) are also necessary, and I like the Courtier (for he's about the only class I know of that just can'f fight, but is more dangerous cause they "fight" in the court), the Shugenja and the Ninja (nice one, and with a drawback you don't see at first: If it comes out that you are one, you are a dead one)

 

[Nightfall]

Pretty I side with Psion in this degree, especially since I felt OA Samurai was good. CW Samurai wasn't.