Non-urgent Adventures and Campaigns?

[Vymair]

One of my tactics is to provide the characters with choices on what they want to investigate, then have the items they ignored continue to organically grow into other possible encounters for later date. The example of this my players remember best (a decade later) is when they heard a rumor about a few minor formians but decided to deal with the orc problem in the next town over instead. Two years later, the key trade road was shut down when the formian hive took over the area.

This concept can also be applied on a smaller level to a single adventure. If the characters pull out to rest, the monsters can reorganize to create a different type of challenge than they would have presented before the characters changed the existing state. This is most commonly represented by setting up traps or ambushes or finding greater concentrations of monsters. For example, the orcs might bunker down to three main locations that can easily flow in defense to one another instead of being scattered. After two weeks, they might get complacent and spread out again. Having these kind of changes will make the world feel organic and cause the characters to consider the cost to pulling out of the dungeon. Sometimes, it's the only choice, but it is not one made without consequences.

 

[pming]

Hiya!

This thread got me thinking. I've been reading too many published adventures lately that all have a timer of some sort. Some big bad Thing is going down, and the adventurers need to stop it. What kind of adventure/campaign can be constructed where taking a week-long rest doesn't result in towns destroyed, kidnapped princesses sacrifced, or the BBEG inching closer to his plan?

I kinda shook my head and felt sad when I read this. Tis true that "modern gaming" has taken a turn for the focus on "story" over "setting". Looking at the adventures by WotC for 5e, we have... Adventure Paths. Pretty much all of the "Oh noes! [insert something bad happening] It's up to you to [goal of the adventure] or else the entirety of the [insert campaign world / Forgotten Realms]...and you only have [insert time frame]!" Pretty much all of them other than, what was it, was it that Temple of Elemental Evil remake? Princes of the Apocalypse? I hear that one was a lot less 'time constrained'. I haven't played/bought any of the AP's because, well, they're AP's. Been there, did that, not interested.

I use OSR/1e/2e/BECMI adventures when I DM 5th Edition. I generally don't use 3.x/PF because the monster amounts encountered are 'backwards' from 5e (in 3.x, seeing a single monster in the middle of the room means "Avoid at all costs!", but seeing a dozen monsters is code for "Lets get 'em, boys!" ; In 5e, it's reversed where a dozen goblins will really put the hurt on a quartet of 3rd to even 5th level PC's...ime anyway).

The "older school" adventures of yore frequently had "plots/stories" that could be easily be completely ignored, modified, hacked or used as-is. But more often than not an "adventure module" was a setting piece where something odd or dangerous was going on in some location and it was the players PC's finding something interesting and exploring for fame, glory and treasure! Like, The Secret of Bone Hill. An old 1e module where the whole "story/plot" was basically "Just outside town, on the top of Bone Hill, and old ruin stands. Lately strange lights and sounds have been seen at night coming from it. What's going on? Is the long dead wizard returned to continue his experiments?" That's it. No end of the world, or even end of the area. Just a mysterious ruins with some new activity going on. It's whatever the players actions and DM's decisions turn it into. It is YOUR story...not the person who wrote it.

So, TL;DR - Go grab some OSR style modules and give 'em a shot.

If you remove time frame pc will nova at each fight who look dangerous.
otherwise time strain is needed to feel the thrill of the hunt.

Game were nothing happens can be dull.
You are at the beach on your desert island, the goal of the day is to get water.
Tomorrow the goal will gather be some fresh fruits.
And next day some fishes.
And then water again.....

I think time strain is an essential part of a good challenge.

Time constraints are great, when used in moderation. If every game has a time constraint, eventually the Players will become apathetic if you are lucky...outright hostile if you aren't. "Oh, great. Let me guess...some evil group is going to summon an evil deity/dragon/demon or other D-word creature who will feast on the souls of men and cause an age of darkness, pain and suffering if we don't put a stop to it by end of next Tuesday? Right?".

The key to defining if a game is "dull/boring" is almost always because of predictability. Beach, water, beach, food, beach, water, beach, food... that's predictable. Save the world, save the world again, save the world again, save the world one more time, save the world yet again... that's predictable. Both are bad for a DM who's trying to keep his campaign entertaining.

As for the whole "nova" thing. You know, almost the ONLY time I've ever seen this is when playing Adventure Paths? Seriously. I think it's because...predictability. It's almost always blatantly obvious that a "big fight" is coming up or is at hand. The players can then feel free to "go nova" because they know that the AP will account for the PC's having spent all their abilities/spells/etc, and will provide a nice, warm safe-space where they can rest and feel good about themselves in comfort. You know what happens when a party "goes nova" in 5e when I'm running an old 1e module, say, The Secret of Bone Hill? TPK's happen...or at least NTPK's (near TPK...all but one PC dies). Why? Because in OSR modules, the adventure isn't written with PC survival being "assumed". Going all nova in the middle of a dungeon if you didn't have to is almost signing your own death warrant. Wandering monsters don't care if your wizard has no spells and your cleric is out of healing, and all your warriors are far below half-HP's.

Anyway, I guess my overall point of suggestion is... go pick up an OSR module or old 1e/BECMI adventure and use it. I am partial to the "DCC Modules" made by Goodman Games back for the 3.x version of D&D. Nice "old school feel". Or my old 1e modules. I can still DM a module for the Nth time and the story and PC's choices STILL surprise me in a very pleasing way!

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[Satyrn]

I kinda shook my head and felt sad when I read this. Tis true that "modern gaming" has taken a turn for the focus on "story" over "setting". Looking at the adventures by WotC for 5e, we have... Adventure Paths. Pretty much all of the "Oh noes! [insert something bad happening] It's up to you to [goal of the adventure] or else the entirety of the [insert campaign world / Forgotten Realms]...and you only have [insert time frame]!" Pretty much all of them other than, what was it, was it that Temple of Elemental Evil remake? Princes of the Apocalypse? I hear that one was a lot less 'time constrained'. I haven't played/bought any of the AP's because, well, they're AP's. Been there, did that, not interested

I'm retty sure that Out of the Abyss's world shaking apocalypse isn't really on a timer until after the players leave the Underdark. Until that point, it's readily run as a sort of sandbox hexcrawl structured around "finding the way home" the way Star Trek: Voyager was about getting home (with the occasional demon encounter to hint at the series finale).

 

[Satyrn]

Anyway, I guess my overall point of suggestion is... go pick up an OSR module or old 1e/BECMI adventure and use it. I am partial to the "DCC Modules" made by Goodman Games back for the 3.x version of D&D. Nice "old school feel". Or my old 1e modules. I can still DM a module for the Nth time and the story and PC's choices STILL surprise me in a very pleasing way!

That said, I totally second this recommendation.

 

[Tony Vargas]

This thread got me thinking. I've been reading too many published adventures lately that all have a timer of some sort. Some big bad Thing is going down, and the adventurers need to stop it.

Yep. It's necessitated by the game's class designs, balance is only theoretically achievable on a sufficiently 'long' day, so time pressure is necessary or it just becomes a game of systematic spellcasting...
...even so APs catch flack for not forcing the 6-8 encounter day more blatantly.

What kind of adventure/campaign can be constructed where taking a week-long rest doesn't result in towns destroyed, kidnapped princesses sacrifced, or the BBEG inching closer to his plan?

Almost any, really, the time-pressure scenario is pretty narrow.

What are some plot hooks that allow for downtime?

Downtime's easy, just put it /between/ the series of time-important quests that force grueling adventuring days.

 

[Ratskinner]

If you remove time frame pc will nova at each fight who look dangerous.
otherwise time strain is needed to feel the thrill of the hunt.

Game were nothing happens can be dull.
You are at the beach on your desert island, the goal of the day is to get water.
Tomorrow the goal will gather be some fresh fruits.
And next day some fishes.
And then water again.....

I think time strain is an essential part of a good challenge.

I don't know about essential for a challenge (mysteries always seem to stump people with or without time pressure), but it is essential for any sort of balance in 5e with a paladin on board. We're up to 6th now and I just have to keep putting clocks out, or working up long drawn-out battle scenarios.

If there's no pressure, they just wait a day and the paladin novas anything to death.

On the other hand, some of the other players seem to have gotten bored with that, and soundly mocked his "cowardice" recently as he wanted to go rest before taking on the rest of the baddies.

 

[hbarsquared]

Some great approaches, thanks everyone.

It's a hard balance when it comes to a "living world" scenario and incorporating downtime. If Bad Things Happen every time the party pursues something else, then the party won't want to have downtime.

The key is to have such a "living world" where things are actually good for a while, or the Bad Thing is on such a slow boil that the party cannot do anything about it.

 

[Blue]

Clean out the undead from X.

Go through the ancient crypt full of traps and constructs.

 

[pming]

Hiya!
[MENTION=6801204]Satyrn[/MENTION] ...I think my brother said something similar about Out of the Abyss. Kinda like it was a bunch of little things here and there, wandering and learning bit by bit, until the "end" and then the time thing kicks in or something? They didn't finish it (TPK fighting Yee-know-who...).

On a semi-OT'ish tangent...I did have a sort of "adventure path" I created for running about 6 of the Hackmaster 4th Edition modules where the "background plot" of Meleanie (sp?) was going to slowly build suspicion about her and how she ends up with all the 'powerful men' bit by bit. Didn't decide on specifics yet. At any rate, with the Old Skool modules of 1e/DCC-type...because they aren't "save the world" (most of the time), it makes it a really enjoyable experience to string a few of them together with specific stories going on in your own campaign. When the players play through them and slowly start to piece things together (weather or not you actually thought of or planned them sometimes!), it really brings the campaign alive. It really makes the campaign as a whole "The Groups". When I hear one groups play of Hoard of the Dragon Queen, and then another groups play of it...they are almost like they were the same group with just some PC's changed. Same "high points" and "low points" because the AP's are designed that way. Some folks love having the story laid out for them to DM...I'm not one of them.

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[Sunseeker]

If you remove time frame pc will nova at each fight who look dangerous.

I can attest to that. Then they'll sit down and rest.

----

There needs to be some time, it just needs to manage "yeah you need to get here by X time, but no the world is not going to implode if you don't".

It's fairly easy to operate on an all-or-nothing system. Either you save the princess and get rich, or you don't and the King puts you to death. Either you stop the bad guy and maybe die, or you don't and everybody dies.

This is not unreasonable, when you compare this to a lot of media, the "action and adventure" happens during Crunch Time. Take LOTR for example: Bilbo had the Ring for some 80 years! 80 years where Saruman wasn't making evil orcs. 80 years where King Theodin wasn't being corrupted (since he wasn't born). 80 years while Sauron was still only just barely marshaling his forces. Coulda dropped the Ring into Mount Doom at any time. Probably could have engaged in a leisurely stroll to get there, stopped and smelled the flowers, smoked some good weed and maybe even walked in the front door! But nope. Stick it on a shelf for 80 years.

This is, typically my experience with a lack of time constraints. Either players will wander (and there's no reason for them not to) and you'll be running "Bob the Fighter goes Longsword Shopping" or players will hit everything with nukes because there's no reason not to.

Now, some players do better with lack of time constraints than others. But that's really something you won't know until you've got the person at the table. I'd argue most players have been trained on a "DO IT NOW!!" mentality so its something of a learning curve that no you don't need to do it now. It just needs to get done.

-----------

All that said: tomb raiding can be a great one. (just don't put a mad lich bent on world domination at the end). Think Indiana Jones. There will be some time constraints here and there, but there won't be overriding time constraints (such as if you don't find the magic object then everyone dies). You might put pressure on the party via NPC parties vying for the same McGuffin. Reward? Lots of gold! Failure? Eh, you're still broke, time to go find another tomb to loot.

Investigative games can be good as an after-the-fact, assuming you don't have (again) the killer planning to strike again and kill everyone! It's up to the party to find who did it, and arrest them.

Time constraints are a natural part of mortal existence (which is something I find difficult dealing with elves or other dramatically longer-lived races), we usually call it "opportunity cost". There should always be some time constraints. But there don't need to be overarching time constraints (such as global annihilation).