OGC Wiki?

[Zelgar]

So the PHB, DMG and MM are worthless?

Zelgar

 

[Man-thing]

Let's look at this in another way. Book X costs $40 when first printed. A year later, a PDF version is released online for $20. Has the value of the material in the book changed? Ok, now the OGC material is taken from the book and is put in another book or put on a Wiki. Has the value of the material in the book changed? What if the entire book was clearly stated as OGC? Just a few things to think about.

Zelgar

Wait this is a distribution chain issue.

If a Box is $40 in a store, the retailer paid $20 to the distributer, who paid the publisher $10.
If it comes out in pdf for $20, the host store keeps $10, and the publisher gets $10.

The value of the material has not changed. It's just cheaper to a consumer for not going through the distribution chain.

Correct?

 

[Zelgar]

It's not a threat, I think it's truth. If an OGC FREE source becomes available publishers will produce less OGC and then some gamers will have negative feelings towards the publishers because of it.

Great. All that acrimony and worry because someone wants FREE OGC?

This is why, as Wulf stated, it's probably unwise.

Hell, everything I've ever released has been 100% open, but now I'm deciding if I should form new opinions on the matter. I don't like it and am not pleased with it.

joe b.

I wonder, how many game designers and publishers had seriously considered what happened when they decided to make content OGC? Did you consider someone taking all of you work and making money without you getting anything in return? Isn't it better that people could be exposed to your work without your competition making a profit off of it?

Zelgar

 

[philreed]

So the PHB, DMG and MM are worthless?

Tell me why you think the SRD exists.

 

[jgbrowning]

Let's look at this in another way. Book X costs $40 when first printed. A year later, a PDF version is released online for $20. Has the value of the material in the book changed? Ok, now the OGC material is taken from the book and is put in another book or put on a Wiki. Has the value of the material in the book changed? What if the entire book was clearly stated as OGC? Just a few things to think about.

Zelgar

I'm talking about how much someone values the creator's opinion. The creator didn't want it to be FREE.

The only OGC I've created that I wanted to be FREE I've already made FREE. If anyone else decides to legally use the license and make some of my for cost OGC FREE, that's their decision, but it tells me how much they value my opinion. It also tends to let me know how much I should, conversely, value theirs.

This is why Wulf's unwise is such a good word. There's no *need* for the acrimony—there is only the desire to get and give away something for free because it can legally be done that seems to be driving the whole thing.

joe b.

 

[Crothian]

So the PHB, DMG and MM are worthless?

Zelgar

I don't own them, I spent that money on other RPG books.

 

[philreed]

Isn't it better that people could be exposed to your work without your competition making a profit off of it?

No, it isn't. I do not want people to think that my work has no value and should be free unless I specifically release free material of my own creation.

 

[jgbrowning]

I wonder, how many game designers and publishers had seriously considered what happened when they decided to make content OGC?

My guess would be Every One of them.

Did you consider someone taking all of you work and making money without you getting anything in return?

Yes. I trusted others to treat my work with respect and not force me to think about being less generous and trusting of others.

Isn't it better that people could be exposed to your work without your competition making a profit off of it?

Zelgar

Nope. I'd rather have another publisher "rip me off" than have my OGC up for FREE. At least the other publisher is protecting the worth of the material, even if he's siphoning off my cash flow. The FREE product is siphoning off cash AND not protecting the worth of the material.

Of course, I'd rather have neither.

joe b.

 

[jgbrowning]

Wait this is a distribution chain issue.

If a Box is $40 in a store, the retailer paid $20 to the distributer, who paid the publisher $10.
If it comes out in pdf for $20, the host store keeps $10, and the publisher gets $10.

The value of the material has not changed. It's just cheaper to a consumer for not going through the distribution chain.

Correct?

Roughly correct. I try to make my PDFs have the same profit per unit as my printed books. This means I'm usually charging around 50-70% less for the PDF.

joe b.

 

[Zelgar]

I'm talking about how much someone values the creator's opinion. The creator didn't want it to be FREE.

The only OGC I've created that I wanted to be FREE I've already made FREE. If anyone else decides to legally use the license and make some of my for cost OGC FREE, that's their decision, but it tells me how much they value my opinion. It also tends to let me know how much I should, conversely, value theirs.

This is why Wulf's unwise is such a good word. There's no *need* for the acrimony—there is only the desire to get and give away something for free because it can legally be done that seems to be driving the whole thing.

joe b.

If the creator didn't want the OGC to be free, they shouldn't of made it OGC. It is the creators decision, unless the material was based upon previous OGC material, to make material OGC or PI.

Also, just because somebody post OGC for free does not mean that they do not value the work. If a game designer or publisher had made some OGC feats that would work with my campaign, I am not devaluing your work if I include them on my campaign website as a list of feats the PC's can take. It would be legal for me to do so, provided I follow all of the requirements of the OGL.

In fact, if I wanted to expand your OGC and post it on a forum like here on ENWORLD, I would be perfectly within my rights as well. Gamers are not trying to crucify the game designers and publishers for OGC nor is that the purpose of a OGC Wiki.

Zelgar