Okay, this whole "points of light" thing . . .

[Rechan]

Baker went on to say that the POL was his intention and general vision. I guess that wasn't implied via the ECS. But the way I see it, there's still lots of threats From Within.

The Blood of Vol/Emerald Claw - pretty much operate in the Five Nations.
The Dreaming Dark - they're everywhere, but they're also trying to Take Over the 5 Nations.
The Lords of Dusk - Could strike inside. Their plots are generally Fairly Big, and they could be operating anywhere, and leave a large swath destroyed. Trying to crash one of the moons into the surface via some ritual is pretty much up their ally.
The cult surrounding the Fiend in the Flame - Thrane-based Rajah worshippers.
The Cults of the Dragon Below - quite a bunch in the 5 Nations.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I view all of those as either threats coming in from the frontier or, essentially, terrorist groups operating within a society. While the Emerald Claw is all sorts of cool, my read on PoL is more Conan and less Indiana Jones. But that's just my read, we'll see if it's borne out in 2008.

 

[Daztur]

Two possible setting spinoff concepts from the Point of Light Idea:

-Point of light: the PC's village is in fact the last human/demi-human village on the continent, perhaps the world.

-The dying of the light. Civilization is crumbling and the darkness is spreading. Rage, rage!

 

[Patlin]

Two possible setting spinoff concepts from the Point of Light Idea:

-Point of light: the PC's village is in fact the last human/demi-human village on the continent, perhaps the world.

That sounds a lot like my submission in the settings concept.

 

[Stone Dog]

I view all of those as either threats coming in from the frontier or, essentially, terrorist groups operating within a society. While the Emerald Claw is all sorts of cool, my read on PoL is more Conan and less Indiana Jones. But that's just my read, we'll see if it's borne out in 2008.

And things from the mournlands come out of the mournlands, things from Khyber come up from Khyber, things from Droaam filter in from Droaam, manifest zones to terrible places lay in wait for the unwary and all manner of possibilities. Eberron doesn't show up right away as POL, but you don't have to twist too far to see that the points may be brighter, but the dark is still all over the place. A few more points. A few of them brighter than normal. A river of fire here and there. Outside of that? Nope.

Check out the inspirational films in there. Sure there is Raiders of the Lost Ark, the new Mummy and Pirates of the Caribean. However there is also The Name of the Rose, From Hell, Brotherhood of the Wolf and Sleepy Hollow. All of them can add some pretty grim stuff to the game.

 

[Daztur]

That sounds a lot like my submission in the settings concept.

Well I ripped that idea off of a thread on rpg.net. Cool idea, but after thinking about it I think that the dying of the light campaign concept fits my style of DMing better.

 

[broghammerj]

All of this POL talk makes me chuckle a bit. Most of the current popular campaigns deviate from the POL model with FR being the most opposite followed by Eberron. I will give Irda Ranger a nod for characterizing Dragonlance as an intermediate. Had Greyhawk not been so poorly abandoned over the years it would have likely had more RPG support and an extensive novel line which would have taken it from a semi POL world to something like FR. I realize this is a bit of revisionist history, but I think it's a side effect of a novel line which Greyhawk doesn't currently have. I think GH support is part nostalgia and part unknown world available for DM development.

The FR hate always amazes me and seems a bit unfounded. I have played extensively in the FR and don't ever seemed to be impacted by Elminster, Drizzt, the Harpers, etc. All campaigns have required us to battle goblins in the wilderness, the Zhentirem in their occupied territory, or evil Giants in the North, etc. Somehow we still ended up being good against the forces of evil in this highly developed and civilized world.

Ah but I digress. I don't see people clamoring for this campaign model. So far no marketed campaign model has succeeded with the POL format. Those previously mentioned like Dark Sun and Ravenloft (I enjoyed them both) would still be in production if they were truly successful.

Once again the flavor changes of 4E seems to be the designers bringing their homebrew to my table rather than rewriting a core mechanics for me to design my own game.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

I realize this is a bit of revisionist history, but I think it's a side effect of a novel line which Greyhawk doesn't currently have.

Not so much that, IMO, it rather is that FR has been burdened/graced with a novel line written by folks who had a barrier beween them and the developers/designers of the world. Authors who told stories where their characters were heroes who left a significant impact on the world, shaping it in new ways. Any setting that had that kind of "support" (yes, irony quotes) from novels would end up the same way as FR has turned out.

Game fiction novels for a setting don't have to be written to change the world in meaningful ways and still be entertaining yarns.

But, yeah, some revisionism in your set up to the point.

 

[broghammerj]

FR has been burdened/graced with a novel line written by folks who had a barrier beween them and the developers/designers of the world. Authors who told stories where their characters were heroes who left a significant impact on the world, shaping it in new ways. Any setting that had that kind of "support" (yes, irony quotes) from novels would end up the same way as FR has turned out.

I think the same barrier exists in GH as Gary no longer has control of it. It's just that GH didn't have a novel line to "support" it (I like your use of irony quotes). Had the tables been turned I think people would complain GH was overdeveloped with NPCs, organizations, detailed kingdoms, etc. As a result it is a pseudo POL model simply due to lack of support.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

So far no marketed campaign model has succeeded with the POL format.

Wilderlands of High Fantasy has been around longer than quite a few posters here have been alive, and there are two separate companies producing D20 modules for it.

Those previously mentioned like Dark Sun and Ravenloft (I enjoyed them both) would still be in production if they were truly successful.

Ravenloft's license was yanked back. It was plenty successful.