Okay, who here LIKES the magic items and magic system in D&D?

[MrFilthyIke]

my hat of what they did to it to make it d02 knows no limits.

Now really diaglo, I hardly even noticed the difference between editions. There are just MORE spells now than ever!

 

[Quasqueton]

I have no problems with it. This is the way magic works in the D&D universe. I like the D&D system because it is the D&D system.

It's like, sure, it would be better and make more sense if I could throw a ball as far, fast, and accurate with my left arm as with my right arm. It would make more sense and logic if it took just only as long to dry clothes as it did to wet them. Why do falling objects speed up as they fall, and why is there a terminal velocity? Things in the Real World work the way they do because they work the way they do.

Magic in the D&D world works the way it does because it works the way it does. This is the pattern, method, and reality of the D&D world. The mages and priests of the D&D world discovered and figured out this system as it exists in the world; they didn't create it. Just as physicists and chemists in the Real World figured out how physics and chemistry work; they didn't create the complicated arithmetic just because they like long calculations.

And if a DM wants magic to be "special", he needs to create something special. If a DM is disappointed with the Players not being impressed or awed by a +1 sword, then he should find a way to make that +1 sword special, not complain that the game system is wrong or bad.

So, to address the issue: all in all, I like D&D magic.

Quasqueton

 

[Mallus]

I like magic that's a bit.. unpredictable. I'm not neccessarily trying to make game magic 'mysterious and spooky', I'm just trying to spice it up a bit, to move away from the complete uniform utility of magic in the RAW.

So certain magic items/spells might have side effects, more variable results than in the RAW, conditional modifiers, combinded effects, etc.

I guess that's what I'm really after; magic that the players have to learn about in game, as opposed to knowing all there is to know at the start, straight from the rules. By only using the standard spells and items I'd be denying the players the pleasure of exploring that aspect of the setting.

I try and ensure magic is always advantageous --if its not a curse--, its just not always the advantage you're expecting...

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Unsafe casting systems never work. I only see them in fantasy novels (eg it's dangerous to summon demons) and yet I never see evil PCs try to call a demon with more Hit Dice than they can control.

I think the magic system is decent, though I wish they would combine the wizard and sorcerer into one class (with more spells known but fewer spells/day than the sorcerer).

I can't stand the assumptions about how you are supposed to be covered with magic items, though, nor do I like the spread between good and poor saves.

 

[Desdichado]

Why is it that I am annoyed so much by people who play D&D and yet have a hate-on for the Vancian system or for "Magic not being special."

Why is it that you're so annoyed by what other folks do in their game anyway? I'm looking at your sig, too. What's your hate on all about? How does it have ANY IMPACT whatsoever on you anyhow that you need to go out an PERSECUTE folks with other tastes? Oh, sure, the persecution isn't very serious, and quite easily ignored, but it still bugs me whenever I see your sig that you have to PREACH to me about how my tastes are the ways of Satan. Who cares? If I don't like Vancian magic, what's it to you? If I want low magic, and still want a d20 base for my game, what's that to you?

You can read all the books you want and watch all the TV shows and play all the other RPGs you like where magic is mysterious and dangerous and unpredictable and SPECIAL. But I LIKE having magic that is predictable and safe to use. I LIKE having magic items that are bought and sold and yes, not treated as if they are unique and special because you can't get another one. I LIKE having magic that can be understood by humans and magic items that can be created by PCs.

Bully for you! The rules (or RAW, to use that increasingly ubiquitious annoying term) support you, so it must be easy for you to run the game you want. It must be nice to be you.

Anyone agree with me?

**looks away uncomfortably and whistles to himself**

Uh, no, I don't. I mean, I don't *hate* the D&D default magic, and I'm in a D&D game that's fun and all that. Of course, I don't play a spellcaster in D&D, and have little interest in doing so, so I can (in many ways) avoid the issue somewhat anyway.

 

[Narfellus]

The only reason that all of our literature views magic as special and unique is that it never existed in our world

That's not quite true. DnD -style magic never existed. Spiritual magic is as old as planet earth. Astrology and alchemy (which became Chemistry) were practiced solely by mystics, and many were heavily persecuted for it.

 

[KB9JMQ]

I only have one annoyance with magic in D&D other than that I like it as is.

 

[Narfellus]

I'll tell you what i DO like about DnD magic, and it's that the system has been building and growing for 30 years. Pretty much every conceivable magical effect has been been brought to the attention of eager readers. Now, the base system is not "mysterious" as I would like, but the tools are out there for any decent DM to tweak it. The great thing is that there are so many spells to churn one's imagination, DM's and players will never run out of ideas, no matter what kind of high or low setting they play.

 

[SWBaxter]

You can read all the books you want and watch all the TV shows and play all the other RPGs you like where magic is mysterious and dangerous and unpredictable and SPECIAL. But I LIKE having magic that is predictable and safe to use. I LIKE having magic items that are bought and sold and yes, not treated as if they are unique and special because you can't get another one. I LIKE having magic that can be understood by humans and magic items that can be created by PCs.

Anyone agree with me?

I don't mind having relatively straightforward magic that's under PC control, some campaigns that's what I want. But having the magical economy as a balancing factor built into the experience/level progression system really bugs me, because it makes it harder to change the system for those campaigns where I don't want magic to be quite so straightforward.

 

[Voadam]

I like that spells work, you don't have to risk it every time you work magic, that works better for me as a tool in a game.

I dislike Vancian spell preparation, it forces a day basis to adventure thinking and prep and feels very gamist. It puts such an emphasis on preparation instead of action and reaction. I think sorcerer and psion styles are much cooler for the game.