One thing I REALLY liked about HERO over D&D

[Thanee]

That sounds really good. A few of my players have been saying they wish they could play a system like that. How would I go about getting/looking into this system? What stuff do I need etc...?

I'd just check the HERO Games website, I think it's www.herogames.com.

Bye
Thanee

 

[PugioilAudacio]

That's better!?

Bye
Thanee

I think so. Unless the player is really immature, he will get the hint that maybe he's using the power just a little too much, or too widely. Additionally, there is always plenty of other situations/abilites that counter an ability. Maybe it's fun to have such and such power, but when the DM is designing an encounter he can create a situation that limits that power. It just requires a little planning on the DM's part.

 

[robberbaron]

With all the wacky Min-Max Prestige Classes flying around I am amazed there is any balance.

IMHO balance has to be viewed from as far away as possible to be able to get everything in the frame, and from what I see, it is fairly OK. There are always areas that need tweaking, due to actual or perceived problems but, on the whole I don't think they've done too badly.

 

[Psion]

That sounds really good. A few of my players have been saying they wish they could play a system like that. How would I go about getting/looking into this system? What stuff do I need etc...?

In the current (5th) edition, there is one main rulebook (and it is pretty big) and a variety of genre books for supers, fantasy, space opera, etc.

Fair waring: the power system requires some fractional math and is not for all players.

Hero Games website:
http://www.herogames.com/

Their products at the ENWorld RPGshop:
http://enworld.rpgshop.com/default.php?manufacturers_id=275

 

[Thanee]

I'm unconvinced.

Ok, just one example.

Unless each character is checked thoroughly (and that, if I understand you right, is what should not be necessary), you can lower the cost of all your abilities to a miniscule fraction of its real cost by inventing and applying all sorts of situational disadvantages, that will simply never come into play.

Now that's just a stupid example off the top of my head, of course.

For a tournament, some sort of balance is necessary, unless it's a character creation (munchkinizing) tournament.

Simply removing the stopsign powers doesn't do that in the slightest.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Mercule]

I've never played I hero tournament, but I wonder if they entertain handmade PCs if they simply just say "no stopsign powers."

I ran a HERO game at a local con once. How I handled it was to pregen about 20 characters and let people choose from them based on a blurb. Did three things: 1) Avoided stop sign mechanics, 2) avoided an hour and a half of chargen at the con, and 3) allowed newbies to get an intro to the system w/o needing advanced math.

 

[Thanee]

I think so. Unless the player is really immature, he will get the hint that maybe he's using the power just a little too much, or too widely.

Well, what I was saying, basically, is, that I find it pretty immature to use this kind of approach, instead of the mature way to just tell the player.

And if the DM uses some sort of power in some way in the campaign, I'm actually of the opinion, that this is obviously fair game, because otherwise it would not be used that way. The DM should lead by example, not demonstrate abuses IMHO.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Psion]

Ok, just one example.

Unless each character is checked thoroughly (and that, if I understand you right, is what should not be necessary), you can lower the cost of all your abilities to a miniscule fraction of its real cost by inventing and applying all sorts of situational disadvantages, that will simply never come into play.

Now that's just a stupid example off the top of my head, of course.

For a tournament, some sort of balance is necessary, unless it's a character creation (munchkinizing) tournament.

Simply removing the stopsign powers doesn't do that in the slightest.

You do know some power modifiers have cautions and stopsigns as well, right?

That said, I agree that this is a frequent munchkin method of trying to game the system: look for disads that won't really be a disad. That's a general problem I have with disads.

At any rate, that's sort of besides my point. Whether or not it's the end-all for the tournament environment, I certainly suspect it's a helpful tool there. But either way, it's not a subject I am that interested in.

More to my point is that I wish that D&Der (or the designers) would stop staking potentially interesting abilities through the heart because they have the potential in very isolated situations to be a game wrecker. It, IMO, waters down the game and very often produces abilities that aren't worth taking. I would prefer they flag it and move on.

 

[PugioilAudacio]

Well, what I was saying, basically, is, that I find it pretty immature to use this kind of approach, instead of the mature way to just tell the player.

And if the DM uses some sort of power in some way in the campaign, I'm actually of the opinion, that this is obviously fair game, because otherwise it would not be used that way. The DM should lead by example, not demonstrate abuses IMHO.

Bye
Thanee

Well yes, for mature players, all you need to do is tell them that maybe the use they are putting their power to is a little abusive. Only when you have a player who wants to use "their power" without regard to how it affects the game does it become necessary to demonstrate the problems with their usage.

 

[PugioilAudacio]

You do know some power modifiers have cautions and stopsigns as well, right?

That said, I agree that this is a frequent munchkin method of trying to game the system: look for disads that won't really be a disad. That's a general problem I have with disads.

It seems to me that with this kind of system, the DM needs to just be a little more on top of things. I'm not familiar with this specific system, but couldn't the DM prepare his adventure, and then give people a list of disads that might actually come up in the adventure?