D&D 4E Original 4E Monsters

[keterys]

If it's easier to copy the text, I'll do it that way. I was assumed putting up the pic from the word docs I'm using would be easier to read.

 

[Zaster]

If it's easier to copy the text, I'll do it that way. I was assumed putting up the pic from the word docs I'm using would be easier to read.

No, your format looks awesome -- I wouldn't change what you're doing. I'm just saying the trade-off is that it makes it tougher to repackage it for the wiki.

I think it would make more sense if opening one of your monster pages on the wiki just brought up one of your JPGs. Maybe it would be worthwhile to ask the powers that be if they could implement image uploads.

 

[Rechan]

I notice a lot of shadow monsters on this page. You have a theme adventure, Keterys?

 

[keterys]

Just where I happen to be in adventures - in one game they're going up against a Cult of Shar at the moment. In the other game, they're in the undead ruins being run by a group worshipping Myrkul, Bane, and Bhaal.

 

[keterys]

I wasn't happy with how shadowy that darkfang was, so I stripped the 'shadow' tag and darkvision and made a more shadowy version to show up with the cult of Shar.

And, thanks to Zaster that was a cinch to toss into the wiki.

 

[Rechan]

First, I'd like to say that I liked the Darkfang and the Shadowfang. I'll probably be using the Vinelord too (Jungle game, plant monsters galore).

But I wanted to ask your advise on monster making. Three questions, really.

I notice, for instance, that you made the Shadowfang a level 8, after adding the slither, but despite the ability that's very skirmisher-ish, it's still a soldier.

So my first question is: how many and what kinds of abilities can you add to a monster before its role changes?

My second question is: how many abilities can you add to an existing monster before its level rises?

The explanation for these questions are because I plan on taking your standard ghoul, strip out the undead qualities (resistances and vulnerability), and slap on these powers:

[Melee] Tongue (standard; at will): Reach 4; +9 vs. Reflex; 1d6+4 damage, plus target is grabbed. Followup attack: +9 vs. Fortitude; Hit: target is pulled 1 square. Effect: If target is adjacent to the [monster], the [monster] makes a free basic attack.

Incredible Hop (move; recharge 6): The [monster] shifts 4 squares. If it has a target grabbed with its tongue, it makes an attack: +9 vs. Fortitude; Hit: target is pulled as many squares as the monster shifts; Miss: target escapes the grab.

How do you think that would impact the ghoul's level or role?

My third question: What I want to do is take your standard harpy, and your deathlock wight, and smash them together into an elite monster. Is that a good idea, powers wise?

 

[keterys]

So, I think you can always mix role up a little. For example, it can only slither once (possibly to escape from being locked down, but I'm guessing best used for a first round spring to the back) - and its fighting style is to lock people down with slows, weakens, grabs, etc. It's actually got a lot of control too, technically That's not that unusual - the ghoul immobilizes and stuns and unleashes a massive damage attack under certain circumstances and has a climb speed and stealth.

There's a lot of gut instinct in how much power you add to a creature with the powers (or remove with resists and such). For example, I increased its level partially because I assumed that it could use slither to get in at least one important attack than usual and I figured ongoing 2 to weaken was a slight upgrade for a soldier. Mostly, I increased it because I figured a Shadowfell version of the creature would be higher level and I didn't feel like decreasing the level of the creature I already made when I thought it was totally fine

Anyhow, on your ghoul question I don't tend to think of being undead as an advantage and your powers definitely add something so I'd be inclined to up the level (or sacrifice something else, like ghoulish bite). Very cool powers, at any rate. At the end of the day it's still very soldiery. It gets creatures to stick to it and protects its allies. It actually doesn't get any real benefit from moving itself, so even though Incredible Hop feels very skirmisher, it's just flexible movement so I think you're safe.

 

[Rechan]

Anyhow, on your ghoul question I don't tend to think of being undead as an advantage and your powers definitely add something so I'd be inclined to up the level (or sacrifice something else, like ghoulish bite).

It's funny you mention the ghoulish bite. See, the reason I like the ghoul is that it does a lot more damage to immobile targets. Which is great if I pair it with a deathlock wight, because their standard ranged attack turns targets immobile.

My problem with the ghoul is that it only has one attack (or really two, but still). They're boring on the battlefield; I like monsters with more than one thing it can do in a fight. So I want to spice them up. But I actually want to decrease their level (since it's a 2nd level party, and these guys are bodyguards for the harpy/wight).

 

[keterys]

Well, I'm with you there on it being boring (heck, even the fact that it stuns (save ends) just ends up being boring) - remember you can always decrease the levels of monsters from their base even with a final level.

So, the trick is that the tongue attack can be used to get a double attack (tongue and bite) - which is very cool, but it is a noteworthy damage increase. I don't think the hop is a big change in power, but especially with multiple ghouls your version is more capable of dealing with attacking targets further away, less vulnerable to radiant damage, and has higher initial burst (once someone is grabbed they're the same, though).

Maybe drop the stun on the bite? Just to check, are you dropping their level by 2? (you have +9s to attacks)

 

[Rechan]

I forgot ghouls stunned when they bit! Ha. That will go.

When I posted the two powers, I just updated the stats to 5th level for sake of convenience; I haven't put the monsters' stats together at all, really. Good suggestion about the tongue/bite thing.

Thanks!