Outrage at prices

[Hjorimir]

/shrug

I don't complain about book prices because I do okay for myself and can afford any of this stuff. But I do think the RPG industry should be very, very careful about rising prices as they may price themselves right out of the market.

I also wonder if the rising costs of book prevents some consumers from ever getting into the hobby at all. There is an associated, long-term cost to the publishers/producers hidden there as well.

 

[JoeGKushner]

What is about other people's outrage that outrages you so?

That it's usually groundless?

That it bleeds over to other threads that have little to do with the initial outrage?

That it's the same story over and over?

That it tends to come in clusters?

That after a while, you just gotta wonder, "What are they thinking?"

That you have to wonder what type of mind condems an entire company for one product?

Things like that.

 

[Crothian]

Joe, you know people complain to complain. THey derail good threads and bring it up over and over and over and over again. I find ignoring them helps or challenging them can be fun. Usually that quiets them down as they have no asnwers.

 

[The Shaman]

*snip*

This all sounds very familiar indeed.

"Usually groundless?" "What are they thinking?" It seems to me that you are (1) dismissing other people's opinions rather than disagreeing with them, and (2) taking their objections much too personally. Again, this seems to be another example of, "Why can't everyone be more like me?!?"

Some game book prices are pretty high, perhaps testing the limits of what the market will bear. The value of some of these books is pretty low for some gamers - it's just not worth the money for a book with maybe 15% content that will actually make it into the game. Some gamers are on limited budgets, such that even the bargain rack is a bit of a reach. How does someone expressing an opinion about this on an Internet bulletin board affect you?

 

[Frozen DM]

I will say that we should not be looking at this in terms of an entitlement mentality. We are not entitled to cheap RPGs, even if we want it. It all boils down to what the market can bear.

And yet, it seems this attitutde of entitlement is exactly the foundation for many of these complaints. People seem to be under the impression that, as a consumer, we are entitled to specific products and prices. No one is forcing them to pay these prices, but in turn, this means that they have no way of satisfying the immediate desire to own a book.

Maybe people feel that, by charging more than they can reasonably afford, that the companies are "shunning" them as consumers? Afterall, if Malhavoc is pricing Ptolus at $120, this product is clearly aimed at people who can afford it (or the monthly payments), and not gamers on a limited budget.

We see this entitlement attitude everywhere. People complain at how expensive comics are, how much movies cost, the price of CDs. In turn, it's this sense of entitlement that is often used as an excuse to justify various forms of piracy (man I hope I didn't just open another can of worms, I apologize up front!). In reality, people should accept that there are some things they can't afford, and stick to products they can.

I've spent huge sums of money on books because I can afford to. Would I have liked to get my signed copy of GoT for $25 instead of $100? Of course! (I'd also like to get the book, period, but that's a different rant). But I can accept that it costs more, and I decided I can justify the cost because I'm an uber-fan/GRR Geek. I'm no more entitled to a cheap version of this book then I am to the $20 Ptolus Hardcover or the $50 Mustang convertible.

I don't think we'll see an end of the complaints. No one can make everybody happy all the time. I think the real problems comes down to this; people overreact to how they feel and then make radical, sometimes even irrational statements in response. The anonymity of the internet means never having to think things through before pressing "Submit".

 

[Poster Bard]

Well, yeah. But these are D&D books. It's not like it's bread or milk. If you can afford a computer connection there's a metric ton of free stuff out there.

All true but that doesn't change how people feel when actually spending their money. It's hard to say how close you've come to hitting the proper price point when people are complaining about the cost of a product but the sure thing is that most of them actually want it.

 

[Dragonhelm]

We see this entitlement attitude everywhere. People complain at how expensive comics are, how much movies cost, the price of CDs. In turn, it's this sense of entitlement that is often used as an excuse to justify various forms of piracy (man I hope I didn't just open another can of worms, I apologize up front!). In reality, people should accept that there are some things they can't afford, and stick to products they can.

Agreed. There is no excuse for piracy. At some point, we as the consumer need to realistically look at what we can and can not afford. What a consumer buys and doesn't buy sends a message to the companies, which in turn will react accordingly.

There are plenty of cheap game products out there as well. PDF's, Castles and Crusades, and various other products are at reasonable price tags and can offer adventure ideas.

In my own case, I've cut down on a lot of things. My comic book habit is diminished, I rarely go to the movies, and I hardly buy CD's any more. I've also had to make choices on what RPG products to keep up on and which ones to lay by the wayside. I try to look for bargains where possible. Amazon and e-bay are big helps in finding cheaper RPG books.

I don't think we'll see an end of the complaints. No one can make everybody happy all the time.

Exactly right.

I think most of the complaints right now are due to the shock of it all. I have to admit, it is a bit shocking seeing the first RPG product you can buy in installments.

In the end, though, the consumer simply has to ask himself whether the higher dollar products are worth it or not. Vote with your dollar, whether in support of a product or in protest to the price tag.

My advice: Only buy the RPG books you think you will enjoy (and preferably use). Then go out and have some ice cream.

 

[Vocenoctum]

Joe, you know people complain to complain. THey derail good threads and bring it up over and over and over and over again. I find ignoring them helps or challenging them can be fun. Usually that quiets them down as they have no asnwers.

Some people complain to complain, some people defend to defend, what have you.

Some people, after a thread was shut down for all the argueing, start another thread to bring up the same points that went around and around in the other thread.

Why are some people outraged about prices? Because everybody is different, with different incomes and different expectations for value.

If a price is so high it's drawing "outrage", perhaps it's not because folks like to complain, perhaps it's that the price is simply too high, and the market is speaking.

Or perhaps folks just don't read what people write in their posts...

So, how many pages will this thread make before Locking?

 

[Vocenoctum]

But some people do... and it's perfectly valid to do so.

It's all about how people value a particular experience.

Some people (many, if your post is true) consider the experience of a video game or DVD movie to be much higher than a (game) book. And that's a legitimate feeling.

In general, I find RPG books to be more entertaining, but I'm sure I'm not alone in RENTING games or DVD's. or even buying a game, then reselling it when I'm done with it. If I keep a game, it's usually because the resale value is good enough to warrant it.

New RPG books have crap resale value, in general. When I bought Fireborn and didn't like it, I sold them for 1/3 of the price I paid.

 

[Crothian]

If a price is so high it's drawing "outrage", perhaps it's not because folks like to complain, perhaps it's that the price is simply too high, and the market is speaking.

THe market will speak with or without the thread. The market will be who is actually buying or not buying. But again, this is one item, not the core rules not anything people have to have. THis is a luxury item in a luxury hobby. A few people that keep saying it is to expensive are no more useful then the few people that are telling us it is not.