Paladin without a Code of Conduct

[JacktheRabbit]

How unbalancing do you think it is to allow a character to run a Paladin without any sort of Code of Conduct written down or even verbally talked about?

I think its pretty bad to have a Paladin only be limited by the obligations of the Lawful Good alignment.

What does everyone else think?

 

[Apok]

Ah, yes. The Paladin. [sarcasm] My favorite subject... [/sarcasm]

It depends on your campaign, I suppose. Personally, I think allowing Paladin's to run around without some sort of Code to follow is a Bad Idea (TM). True, they must abide by the strictures of the LG alignment, but the PHB description is a little airy and open to interpretation on some issues.

I need not point out the large number of Paladin behavior threads that poped up on these boards in days past to prove my point, yes?

Letting Paladins operate sans a Code of Behavior removes the strongest leash that you as a DM have on them. Everyone interpretes the behavior of "Lawful Good" differently, and I for one prefer consistency in my Paladins. If the player doesn't know what you expect out of him in terms of behavior, then he will resent it when you take away his Paladinhood for acting inappropriately. What you might try is using a well-defined Code of Behavior instead of the alignment restriction. Allow the Paladin to be whatever flavor of Good he wants, but he must follow his Code to the letter or face the loss of his powers. This way, there are no gray areas and the player knows exactly what he should and shouldn't do. This will also save valuable game time by forestalling in-game arguments over comparitive morality and the nature of the LG alignment.

I've had these problems before from a fellow player because he and the DM didn't draft a Code for his Paladin to follow, and both had differing ideas on how Paladin's should behave in certain situations.

 

[Oracular Vision]

I have an Elven (Elvish for you Sean) Paladin in Living Greyhawk, and his code of conduct is Elves First!, which means he looks after any elves in the party, treating their wounds, protecting them, and so on, above the needs of the others, treating them in turn only after the elves in the party are okay. Why would a Paladin of Corellon not look after elves first?

Similiarly, Paladins of Moraddin would prefer dwarves, etc., etc. It was pretty dumb to remove the human restriction without opening the behavior up to racial preferences. What about a Paladin of Vecna? There is no rule against it in LG (There are rules about what god's the clerics can have, and they couldn't worship Vecna without being evil, so that's not allowed.) But there are no restrictions on which god a paladin can worship. A paladin of Vecna, while extreme, is not prohibited, yet is expected to act just like a Paladin of Pelor. Clearly, this is not how it would or should work out.

 

[Frostmarrow]

If he's not LG he is not a paladin. He may be a smurf for all I care but he's certainly not a paladin. That's it. Yeah. I think you'll find that some people are pretty unreasonable when it comes to the paladin. The paladin must be lawful good. This will never change. Ever. I won't hear of it. Sorry. Why would you want a paladin with another alignment anyway? What's the point? To me it's just a cheap trick to piggyback on the trusted paladin's well earned respect.

 

[Gargoyle]

How unbalancing do you think it is to allow a character to run a Paladin without any sort of Code of Conduct written down or even verbally talked about?

I think its pretty bad to have a Paladin only be limited by the obligations of the Lawful Good alignment.

What does everyone else think?

Focusing purely on balance:

I feel the paladin is balanced as written. The paladin can cast spells, heal, gets a special mount, and can turn the undead. He also gets the base attack bonus, and weapon and armor proficiencies of a fighter. If you remove the Code of Conduct, I'd say something should go.

WOTC has repeatedly stated that roleplaying requirements shouldn't be used to balance game mechanics. However, paladins are special, and violating the Code has tangible consequences, and is a balancing factor.

If the Code doesn't fit your idea for paladins in your campaign, I'd say get rid of it, but also take away some abilities. Removing the spells, remove disease ability, and lay on hands seems about right to me. They still get divine health, divine grace, detect evil, smite evil, turn undead, and their mount. But I probably wouldn't get rid of the Code.

 

[Gargoyle]

I have an Elven (Elvish for you Sean) Paladin in Living Greyhawk, and his code of conduct is Elves First!, which means he looks after any elves in the party, treating their wounds, protecting them, and so on, above the needs of the others, treating them in turn only after the elves in the party are okay. Why would a Paladin of Corellon not look after elves first?

Similiarly, Paladins of Moraddin would prefer dwarves, etc., etc. It was pretty dumb to remove the human restriction without opening the behavior up to racial preferences. What about a Paladin of Vecna? There is no rule against it in LG (There are rules about what god's the clerics can have, and they couldn't worship Vecna without being evil, so that's not allowed.) But there are no restrictions on which god a paladin can worship. A paladin of Vecna, while extreme, is not prohibited, yet is expected to act just like a Paladin of Pelor. Clearly, this is not how it would or should work out.

Paladins can't associate with evil characters but can worship an evil god? I think this is a common sense issue, and needs no rule.

 

[Gargoyle]

I have an Elven (Elvish for you Sean) Paladin in Living Greyhawk, and his code of conduct is Elves First!, which means he looks after any elves in the party, treating their wounds, protecting them, and so on, above the needs of the others, treating them in turn only after the elves in the party are okay. Why would a Paladin of Corellon not look after elves first?

Similiarly, Paladins of Moraddin would prefer dwarves, etc., etc. It was pretty dumb to remove the human restriction without opening the behavior up to racial preferences. What about a Paladin of Vecna? There is no rule against it in LG (There are rules about what god's the clerics can have, and they couldn't worship Vecna without being evil, so that's not allowed.) But there are no restrictions on which god a paladin can worship. A paladin of Vecna, while extreme, is not prohibited, yet is expected to act just like a Paladin of Pelor. Clearly, this is not how it would or should work out.

While I don't think getting rid of the Code of Conduct is a good idea, I agree it's a great idea to customize it to the paladin's patron deity.

 

[Holy Bovine]

I have allowed the paladin in my campaign to create his own code of conduct. I don't have him wirte it down but the basic tenants are pretty obvious anyway (helps widows and orphans, heals the sick, protects the innocent, punishes the guilty and evil etc).

A neat little tidbit he just 'added' (actually he has played him this way since the beginning) is that he won't lie if asked a direct question.

Was a major hindrance when the party was trying to get into an evil druid city and the gate guards asked who he was and what his business in the city was. His response?

"I am a paladin of Corean and I am trying to find a cure for the plague that is coming from your city."

Whoops!!

 

[Darklone]

Lawful Good

Well Paladins... Lawful good is relative. A dragon that is lawful good will eat you nonetheless if you disturb him without some proper presents, treasures, stories or whatever may interest him.

A paladin of Vecna might have his own interpretation of lawful good. At least about the lawful part.

 

[Hand of Evil]

A code defines his views, if there is no code everything becomes an interptation. I just see conflict on what he may see as being LG and what others may think it is. Thinking of all the threads I have seen..."Is blackstab an evil action..." Let's not go there!

I think it is important to define EVIL to your players, this is the world view. The code defines how the paladin sees the world.

I normally use the Boy Scout code as a guide line.