Perception with other skills

[Garthanos]

Alright, bonus question... for 1XP: How does a "keywording" system could play into this?
I.e. if your background stuff were represented by hardcoded keywords (a bit like Wrecan's 36 aspects). E.g. I've got say "Noblesse; Vecna worship; Arrogant; Fallcrest".

That would be a way to plug in @Grogg of the North's Awesome Dwarves Super Secret DM Mod, without resorting to an on-the-fly arbitrary decision (which I avoid whenever possible).

If you have good keywords could be excellent....


In 4e having a skill "trained" is a full five, if you presume activities will often have atleast one key word available within the party applicable (perhaps even just one of the persons doing an aid another)
Then the benefit for being trained might be something like 3 instead of 5.

One could develop more areas of keywords familiarity to make a more free form gradual advancement system based on what they ran in to during the story if you liked (rather like background skills can give a +2 ) so maybe we make the first one +2 and the second one more.

Just spit balling

 

[Rolenet]

Yes, but the question is how it can interact with the Skill+Stat model.

Maybe replace the skill with the keyword? Or maybe some peripheral bonus, like a reroll?

Ars Magica has a concept that works rather well: skill specialization, whereby you choose a spec for each skill, e.g. "Jumping" for Athletics, or "Dragons" for Bluff(*). Keywords could be tied to a skill. (But I think that would be uselessly limiting).

(*) Don't

 

[Garthanos]

Yes, but the question is how it can interact with the Skill+Stat model.

Maybe replace the skill with the keyword? Or maybe some peripheral bonus, like a reroll?

Ars Magica has a concept that works rather well: skill specialization, whereby you choose a spec for each skill, e.g. "Jumping" for Athletics, or "Dragons" for Bluff(*). Keywords could be tied to a skill. (But I think that would be uselessly limiting).

(*) Don't

Yes I was thinking one might take it as skill proficiency = +3

First most appropriate keyword + 2

Only somewhat appropriate keyword or Second significantly appropriate keyword +1

 

[Campbell]

Blades in the Dark does not have traditional Perception checks or Knowledge checks. Instead the GM is responsible for telling you what your character sees or knows based on what makes sense. It does have general rules for Gathering Information that can be applied to a number of different Actions - what the game replaces Skills with. When you Gather Information you ask the GM a question that goes beyond the obvious situation. How well you roll determines how useful the information is. Answers obviously depend on what Action you take and how you go about it.

Included examples:

• What do they intend to do?
• How can I get them to [X]?
• What are they really felling?
• Where are they vulnerable?
• Where did [X] go?
• How can I find [X]?
• What's really going on here?

 

[Rolenet]

Blades in the Dark does not have traditional Perception checks or Knowledge checks. Instead the GM is responsible for telling you what your character sees or knows based on what makes sense. ...
How well you roll determines how useful the information is. Answers obviously depend on what Action you take and how you go about it.

That's odd. Why is there one system without rolls, and one with?
Is the without part similar to GUMSHOE, that is you have to spend points to get the info, or just "at-will"?

 

[Campbell]

That's odd. Why is there one system without rolls, and one with?
Is the without part similar to GUMSHOE, that is you have to spend points to get the info, or just "at-will"?

It's pretty much at will. The idea is that we only engage the mechanisms when players are actively doing something. Everyone sees what is in front of them, and knows the things they know based on what makes sense in the fiction. Gathering Information is for when you actively go out and seek stuff out, possibly running into trouble along the way or using time you could be using for other things. To get information you could Study some books, Hunt down a rival, Survey an enemy's lair, Consort with some locals at a tavern, Command some thugs to tell you what they know. You get the picture. Out there doing stuff. It is the game's way of encouraging action over passivity.

 

[TBeholder]

This is intriguing. IRL, perception is clearly not a single "skill". People notice stuff they care about, or know. A car enthusiast will just *hear* a V6 closing in, or *see* a modified exhaust. While the ornithologist will see nothing of that but notice a small, distant bird in the sky.

Despite this, we've mostly lived with the ubiquitous Perception skill.

It should be an attribute rather than skill, but D&D traditionally sweeps it into some or other corner.
Which would resolve this in a trivial way: Awareness (or whatever) skill using Perception to detect and Specific Skill (Perception instead of whatever its default) to identify.

 

[Psikerlord#]

The game still has perception check bonuses in various places in the rules which could work fine even without the "perception skill"

I am comfortable removing the perception skill ... if a class or build ought to get a bonus to perception skill it becomes a bonus to perception checks.

Low Fantasy Gaming splits Wisdom into Willpower and Perception. I think perception works better as a stat than a skill (although LFG uses a roll equal or under stat [+mods] mechanic as opposed to a DC [+ mods] mechanic).

 

[Rolenet]

Alright now here's a challenge for you guys: do you now of a game that has skills, but does not include Perception (or synonym) as a skill?

I do know one, do you?