Pathfinder 2E PF2E Gurus teach me! +

[Thomas Shey]

Concentrate mostly makes things with it interact with certain other things; for example, you can't use a Concentrate ability while under Barbarian Rage.

The big one is if you are adjacent to something with attack of opportunity (which, note, is much rarer in PF2e than D&D3e or PF1e), and use a Concentrate ability, it can trigger the AoO (AoOs are also Reactions, which means even most things that have them can only do one a round, and there are other things that can trigger one).

 

[niklinna]

I do 5e and am looking into P2.

I like mages and need to understand exactly what is going on.

What, exactly, is the "Concentrate" trait. I cant seem to find explicit rules for it.

Rules - Archives of Nethys: Pathfinder RPG Database

 

[Campbell]

I do 5e and am looking into P2.

I like mages and need to understand exactly what is going on.

What, exactly, is the "Concentrate" trait. I cant seem to find explicit rules for it.

Is it possible to concentrate on two things that require concentration?

Does concentration always cost an "action" or more?

What are the important mechanical features of this trait?

Oops. Ninjed by @Thomas Shey .

 

[niklinna]

Concentrate mostly makes things with it interact with certain other things; for example, you can't use a Concentrate ability while under Barbarian Rage.

And that is specifically because Barbarian Rage itself is tagged [Concentrate]!

 

[Yaarel]

Rules - Archives of Nethys: Pathfinder RPG Database

If I understand correctly, the link doesnt explain the "Concentrate" trait.

Some spells have this trait, and some spells dont. What is the difference, mechanically?

 

[Yaarel]

Concentrate mostly makes things with it interact with certain other things; for example, you can't use a Concentrate ability while under Barbarian Rage.

The big one is if you are adjacent to something with attack of opportunity (which, note, is much rarer in PF2e than D&D3e or PF1e), and use a Concentrate ability, it can trigger the AoO (AoOs are also Reactions, which means even most things that have them can only do one a round, and there are other things that can trigger one).

So, the Concentrate trait has no mechanics, but other mechanics might refer to it?

 

[Thomas Shey]

If I understand correctly, the link doesnt explain the "Concentrate" trait.

Some spells have this trait, and some spells dont. What is the difference, mechanically?

Whether they're compatible with some other traits and trigger some reactions. That's it. There's nothing Concentrate intrinsically does.

 

[Thomas Shey]

So, the Concentrate trait has no mechanics, but other mechanics might refer to it?

Yup.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Rules - Archives of Nethys: Pathfinder RPG Database

Link here appears to be related to PF1.

 

[Gammadoodler]

So, the Concentrate trait has no mechanics, but other mechanics might refer to it?

Yeah, things like this are probably some if the more confusing aspects of PF2e.

Many/most actions in PF2e have traits (or are triggered by other actions' traits), and some of those traits have traits (e.g. the interact trait has the manipulate trait, having the invisible trait can grant the hidden trait, etc.).

The book is good about tagging things, but it's a level of complexity that requires mental bandwidth that doesn't seem worth the effort in many cases.

 

[Yaarel]

Yeah, things like this are probably some if the more confusing aspects of PF2e.

Many/most actions in PF2e have traits (or are triggered by other actions' traits), and some of those traits have traits (e.g. the interact trait has the manipulate trait, having the invisible trait can grant the hidden trait, etc.).

The book is good about tagging things, but it's a level of complexity that requires mental bandwidth that doesn't seem worth the effort in many cases.

4e and 5e have this kind of stuff too. For example, the 4e "Bloodied" condition and the 5e "Psionic" tag, dont have mechanics in themselves, but other mechanics can refer to them.

It just needs to be clear, when a flavor text clarifies there is actually no mechanics, but there can be mechanics elsewhere relating to it.

I agree, reducing complexity as much as possible ("but not simpler" than that) is an important goal.

 

[Yaarel]

How easy is it to play different settings in P2?

How baked in is the Golarion flavor into the classes and rules, in practice.

For example,

The stereotype of Nordic peoples as the "fur-clad raiders" Ulfen is uninformed and a bit offensive.

Also, I am less interested in the gods scene, and the core Cleric class seems to require it.

What do P2 players do for non-Golarion settings?

 

[W'rkncacnter]

And that is specifically because Barbarian Rage itself is tagged [Concentrate]!

no, it's because the last point of rage is literally and verbatim "You can't use actions with the concentrate trait unless they also have the rage trait. You can Seek while raging."

 

[Scribe]

Many/most actions in PF2e have traits (or are triggered by other actions' traits), and some of those traits have traits (e.g. the interact trait has the manipulate trait, having the invisible trait can grant the hidden trait, etc.).

 

[Gammadoodler]

Exactly..sometimes. It doesn't come up all that often, and some things are common enough that they are easy-ish to memorize ("prone"= "flat-footed"+additional penalties).

But at least once every session or 2 in our group, we'll spend a couple minutes chasing down a Russian nesting doll worth of traits and rules references to figure out something that should take 1 sentence to explain.

 

[Gammadoodler]

How easy is it to play different settings in P2?

How baked in is the Golarion flavor into the classes and rules, in practice.

For example,

The stereotype of Nordic peoples as the "fur-clad raiders" Ulfen is uninformed and a bit offensive.

Also, I am less interested in the gods scene, and the core Cleric class seems to require it.

What do P2 players do for non-Golarion settings?

In my experience, while our campaign is set in Golarion, almost none of the core class or racial features have explicit setting correspondence.

If it'd been set in fantasy Philadelphia, I think the impact on character creation would have been negligible (assuming you're cool with elves, dwarves and goblins being residents in fantasy Philadelphia).

 

[Yaarel]

In my experience, while our campaign is set in Golarion, almost none of the core class or racial features have explicit setting correspondence.

Fair enough.

Reading the Cleric class in the Archive of Nethys that removes setting "lore", feels a bit different from the one in the Core Rulebook that bakes in the lore.

For example, the Archive of Nethys even adds: "While the vast majority of clerics revere a specific deity, a small number dedicate themselves to a divine concept worthy of devotion—such as battle, death, justice, or knowledge—free of a deific abstraction."

So at least there is a heads up, that it is possible to use Cleric class for other other sacred concepts.

I prefer "core" rules avoid baking in a specific setting. Especially core classes need to function in different kinds of settings. But at least the Archieve of Nethys is an available version of the rules that is more setting neutral.

For me that is a plus.

 

[Staffan]

So, the Concentrate trait has no mechanics, but other mechanics might refer to it?

Yes. The most important ones are that casting a spell with verbal components have the Concentrate trait by default, and you can't use Concentrate actions/activities while raging.

How easy is it to play different settings in P2?

How baked in is the Golarion flavor into the classes and rules, in practice.

For example,

The stereotype of Nordic peoples as the "fur-clad raiders" Ulfen is uninformed and a bit offensive.

Also, I am less interested in the gods scene, and the core Cleric class seems to require it.

What do P2 players do for non-Golarion settings?

The biggest thing that's part of the rules themselves are deities and their connection to Champions, Clerics, and various Divine spells. Mechanically, deities have the following relevant parts:

• Alignment (which affects some spells – e.g. divine lance is a cantrip that deals damage of a type corresponding to one of your deity's alignments, so a follower of the LG god Torag can deal lawful or good damage with it).
• Follower's alignments (restricts which alignments can get divine oomph from the god in question)
• Divine ability (as in ability score, mainly used in one or maybe a small number of backgrounds)
• Divine font (whether clerics of the deity cast harm or heal with their Divine Font ability, and various effects that follow from that; in almost all cases this is linked to alignment)
• Divine skill (a skill all champions and clerics of the deity are trained in)
• Favored weapon (a weapon all champions and clerics of the deity are trained in)
• Domains (domains that have focus spells that champions and clerics can learn via feats)
• Alternate domains (more domains that require a particular feat to take, often considered part of alternate interpretations/traditions of worshiping that deity)
• Spells (a set of usually three spells that are considered divine spells for clerics of the deity – some deities give more spells, but that's pretty rare)

There are also various spells which require that you have a deity, usually because they have an effect depending on which deity you worship (e.g. righteous might which turns you into a battleform with weapons determined by your deity).

The canonical (ironically) solution for people who want to cast divine spells without worshiping a deity is to be an Oracle instead.

As for ethnicities and rules connected to those: there are some ancestry feats, mostly in books in the Lost Omens product line (the Golarion setting). I don't think there are any in the core books.

 

[Yaarel]

The canonical (ironically) solution for people who want to cast divine spells without worshiping a deity is to be an Oracle instead.

I saw the Oracle class in Nethys. It has a great "fate" vibe, that works well for certain setting concepts. From highest to lowest, all creatures are subject to fate, even the fates themselves.



The thing about the Cleric class, it is important because of:
• Melee gish
• Fullcaster
• Best healer
• Abjuration magic (protection, healing, etcetera)

It would be a useful class for some of my settings, if its settings-specific deities cosmology didnt keep on getting in the way of the settings.

As for ethnicities and rules connected to those: there are some ancestry feats, mostly in books in the Lost Omens product line (the Golarion setting). I don't think there are any in the core books.

I will check it out.

 

[Yaarel]

Not sure if the following is a rules question, a setting question, or even a social encounter question:

How does a Wizard "buy" new spells during downtime?



I have a level 3 Wizard. (I am building him up to level 5 to translate a current character from an other game into P2.) (I was impressed with how much flavor I was able to put together for him, already at level 1.)

Pathfinder measures out magic item treasure as part of Wealth per Level (gated by level).

I want more spells for my character, but also want to stay within the limits of gaming balance.

So. It seems like my Wizard should be able to use money to buy new spells during down time.

From what I understand, I cannot change a purchased Scroll spell into a spellbook spell instead?



I see a cost for materials to try learn a spell. Is this actually the cost of acquiring the spell too?

My character is still in contact with the mentor Wizard, who could supply more spells to try learn. But I dont want to abuse this narrative mechanically.

Any extra spells would count toward "treasure", but I am unsure what cost value to assign.



What is the best way for my Wizard "purchase" new spells for his spellbook?