Pathfinder 2E PF2E Gurus teach me! +

[niklinna]

An additional general tip, specific to going from 5e to PF2e, the spellcasters will feel a looooott less powerful and martials will feel a looooott stronger, especially at early levels.

The balance they've struck is very very good, but players coming in with a 5e spellcaster mentality will be in for a bit of a shock.

Agreed. I was playing a druid, and felt pretty much on par with the martials, which is a good thing in my book, but which someone used to 5e might not like. The build versatility more than makes up for it, as far as I'm concerned. (I mean, that's a big part of why many choose Pathfinder 2e over 5e anyhow, you get to make meaningful advancement choices just about every level, rather than when you choose your subclass.)

Also regarding spellcasters, "multiclassing" & archetypes also don't just continue the full caster spell slot progression. You have to spend feats from your base class, and those come with fewer spell slots. It's still a meaningful addition to your character though and hoo boy are there lots of options starting with the Advanced Player's Guide. (The core book just presents the base classes as "multiclass" archetypes.)

I don't have much more to say since my play experience was limited, but I've been eyeing that thaumaturge class in case I ever do stumble into a new campaign. It looks like gobs of fun.

 

[Staffan]

Apologies if this is clearly defined in the core books, but, is this defined in the core books? Is the math more open/explained?

It's not so much wealth-by-level, as it is two (maybe three) specific magic items: weapon and armor (or technically the runes on them).

Magic weapons and armor are based on runes, and each rune has an item level (which is the minimum you need to craft it, and usually you can't buy it before that level, but you can in theory find one and use it – one of the developers have even said that a nice way to give the party a taste of the next level is to give them a magic item a level too early). These runes are what give weapons and armor their bonuses (attack bonus and extra damage dice for weapons, AC bonus and save bonus for armor).

I don't think the game outright says you're supposed to have a +1 weapon by level 2, but it does say you're supposed to have a certain number of level 2 items.

Edit: the third potential item I was thinking of was the apex item. There is a set of level 17 items that each boost a stat to 18 or by +2, whichever is higher, and you can only have one of them. I don't know if the game's math assumes you're using one of these for your primary stat or that you'll use it to shore up a bad stat. I suppose they assume you'll use it on your primary stat, because by level 17 any stat you care even a little about should be at 18 already.

 

[Thomas Shey]

The two most important thing I tell to people new to PF2e are as follows (and both of these are a consequence of watching people used to PF1e, D&D3e, and even D&D5e do a face plant on these):

1. The monster leveling system is, for the most part, not kidding. If you think you can upgrade all the encounters to Level+2 or Level+3 without it being a distinctly (and potentially TPK producing) hard row to hoe, you will probably get a serious surprise.

2. People who are used to being able to cruise through a game on autopilot, will probably find even encounters built to level too difficult. PF2e assumes people will actually engage with the situation, and figure how to apply at least their own, and probably their group's abilities to it. If you don't, you'll get your head handed to you.

A more psychological and less game-play-per-se issue is that the power levels of caster and noncaster characters have been pushed at least closer together in PF2e. This does not always delight people used to spellcasters from other editions and adjacent games.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I think the biggest difficulty issue with Pathfinder at "run-time" has to do with conditions and the way they interact. For instance, let's say we're fighting something relatively tough so we're piling on all we can, and the poor bastard's been hit with:

• Clumsy 2 from a poison, giving a -2 status penalty to basically everything Dexterity-related,
• Frightened 1 from the paladin Demoralizing the foe, which get them a -1 status penalty to all checks and DCs.
• Flatfooted because I and my buddy are flanking them, for a -2 circumstance penalty to AC.

Since the status penalties don't stack, the enemy has a net -4 to AC. And when listed like that, that seems kind of obvious, but in actual play it's fairly easy to forget what's a status bonus and what's a circumstance bonus.

This would actually be my biggest concern when running the game (which I've yet to do).

 

[Velderan]

Basically what would you say to someone looking to give it a wirl?

What pitfalls, what works, what are some of the best interpretations, what is a good intro adventure.

How do I navigate the web for more? Like what’s the paces at Paizo, what are the good 3pp places.

I ask a lot because am ignorant.

Thanks!

Plus thread whatchamacalit.

I went by my FLGS yesterday in what was supposed to be my monthly trip to pick up some D&D WizKids minis. I left instead with the Pathfinder 2e Beginner Box. Having never played Pathfinder, I wanted to see how Paizo explains their game to people who may not have ever played a TTRPG. I haven't read through the books included so far, but looking over what's included I'm impressed with the contents.

• 72 page Hero's Handbook aimed at explaining the game to players.
• 88 page Game Master's Guide which contains a sample adventure to help teach the game.
• A double sided map for the sample adventure. It's made out of a really high quality thin cardboard so it's pretty durable and doesn't seem like it will rip with repeated use.
• 13 plastic pegs for use with a couple included sheets of character and monster tokens for the included adventure.
• 6 player reference cards to hand out, which explains some examples of what a player can do on their turn. The backside has a more in-depth explanation of each actions mechanics.
• 4 pregenerated character sheets, which fold out to explain the specific mechanics that apply to that character's class.
• A set of dice

The only thing I think they should have included is a basic GM screen, but otherwise for a set that's aimed at new RPG players they included enough to get you started. I'm looking forward to reading through the books to see how they explain the game for new players. For $40, everything in the box has a nice high quality feel to it.

 

[Velderan]

So besides the adventure included in the Beginner Box, any suggestions on an adventure to run for someone new to the system?

 

[Retreater]

So besides the adventure included in the Beginner Box, any suggestions on an adventure to run for someone new to the system?

Trouble in Otari is a series of short, interconnected adventures that link to the Beginner Box - and it's a natural follow up.
Also if you want a big dungeon, you can put the Abomination Vaults in the background for the party to go visit. It's fairly straightforward.

 

[Staffan]

So besides the adventure included in the Beginner Box, any suggestions on an adventure to run for someone new to the system?

Troubles in Otari and the Abomination Vault AP follow off the adventure in the Beginner Box.

 

[bert1001 fka bert1000]

The two most important thing I tell to people new to PF2e are as follows (and both of these are a consequence of watching people used to PF1e, D&D3e, and even D&D5e do a face plant on these):

1. The monster leveling system is, for the most part, not kidding. If you think you can upgrade all the encounters to Level+2 or Level+3 without it being a distinctly (and potentially TPK producing) hard row to hoe, you will probably get a serious surprise.

2. People who are used to being able to cruise through a game on autopilot, will probably find even encounters built to level too difficult. PF2e assumes people will actually engage with the situation, and figure how to apply at least their own, and probably their group's abilities to it. If you don't, you'll get your head handed to you.

Although this is very true, especially if you use off the shelf adventures as is, PF2e also makes it very easy to change this if you wanted to. Play an official adventure a level or two above suggested or adjust encounters using the system parameters which work and you can have "easy mode" back. I think that probably nullifies a lot of the strengths of PF2e so better off just using another system but it is an option for those that just want to autopilot and are attracted to other parts of pf2e.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Although this is very true, especially if you use off the shelf adventures as is, PF2e also makes it very easy to change this if you wanted to. Play an official adventure a level or two above suggested or adjust encounters using the system parameters which work and you can have "easy mode" back. I think that probably nullifies a lot of the strengths of PF2e so better off just using another system but it is an option for those that just want to autopilot and are attracted to other parts of pf2e.

Sure. This is primarily directed at people who are used to PF1e, D&D 3X or D&D5e. If they go in blind, they're liable to be unpleasantly surprised. This is particularly true with the former two (which I'm more familiar with) because you can't really bake a cake in character generation and advancement and then play them on autopilot.

The fact the encounter balancing actually works, the character generation and advancement really only gives you so much ability to completely bake a cake, and the game assumes a certain degree of engagement are simply things that may bring you bad places if you don't account for them. Your reaction is, in the end, a way of accounting for them (though some people may find it unsatisfactory because they're used to certain kinds of opponents being, effectively, pushovers--and those aren't going to be the ones they're up against if they're fighting pushovers; they'll be ones that more obviously should be).