D&D 4E Piracy and 4e

[Cergorach]

Unless you're downloading a hosted file (which is unlikely), you're probably sharing it in the very moment you download it (if you use current file-sharing, which is likely).

If he wants it quickly without sharing there is an old method (almost 30 years old) readily available that only downloads and does not upload. I don't think that ENWorld is the place to discuss the methods of actual filesharing...

 

[Rechan]

I obtained Elder Evils literally 70 seconds after I read Rechan's post, one minute of which was spent on downloading.

Be aware that my "source" doesn't go to newsgroups. Just torrent sites. And the bigger emphasis was City of Stormreach and the Pathfinder APs, particularly the new one.

 

[nothing to see here]

A problem. But not an unexpected one.

I have never bought a D&D book without checking out a pirate copy first. That has saved me a load of pain and waste of money.

Also all the books I did buy I still keep the Pirate PDF copy for easy consulting, especially outside my home.

Yet I still bought a load of 3.5 edition books.

When we started Star Wars RPG... if it weren't for the pirate pdf copies we handed over to players we would have never managed to play. Eventually half the players bought a SW book. No pirate copies would probably have meant less sales.

So piracy doesn't hurt D&D much

A bit of an over-generalization there, don't you think? Just because you engage in piracy but still spend money to purchase the products doesn't meant that "piracy doesn't hurt D&D". If everyone was like you then Wizards would be smart to ENCOURAGE piracy.

Of course piracy hurts D&D, like it hurts movies, music, video games and any other commercial copyright. Companies introduce new technologie and new strategies to stop it, but if you are bound and determined to circumvent the law to get a free book you will.

This pain, however, is both manageable and expected by the company.

The closest analogue to piracy is not 'theft' in the general sense of the word, but shoplifting. A certain kind of person shoplifts, they always will shoplift. WHile stores will catch and prosecute a few shoplifters -- most will get away with it. As a result, shoplifting costs are built into a stores pricing. Ulitmatley the best defence against shoplifting remains the general law-abiding good intention of most consumers, and the denormalization of those who routinely break shoplifting laws.

That people still obey laws that are virtually unenforceable remains one of the biggest votes of confidence that our soceity is not going to hell in a handbasket as some cynics would suggest.

It's often a lost fact in internet land but, only a fringe of gamers are trolling P2P sites looking for somthing for nothing. Most mainstream consumers still are happy to legally puchase their own materials, which aside from being ethical, also brings a certain guarantee of quality. This is true for virtually every copyright product (with the possible exception of traditional pop music distribution channels, the atrophying of which is the result of two or three very particular historical events.)

 

[nothing to see here]

The fact that NASCAR is insanely popular, while true, is beside the point. Forget popularity. Forget the differences in production costs. On a viewer-by-viewer basis, NASCAR watchers are still more likely to buy the things being advertised at them than Firefly fans.

Ironically, one of Firefly's major problems was that it had a broad appeal--It's fans varied across enough demographics that it wasn't a good venue for targeted advertisements.

Your first paragraph is not exactly true. A lot of sci-fi fans are resistent to mainstream advertising because they hold disparaging opinions of sports, hollywood movies or other mainstream pop-culture artifacts.

This does not make them 'smarter' or more 'discriminating'. Sci-fans will buy exaclty what you sell them if you market to their own predispositions. Not being the target demographic of specific ad, is different than being too smart for mass marketing in general. People on these boards who thank that they are just that smart are deluding themselves.

In fact, look at these very boards. WOTC's "3 nibbles" a week preview strategy for 4e is absolutely DOMINATING discussion on these boards. A few weeks ago people were disdainful of 4e marketing, now they are consumed with speculation and discussion about this tidbit or that. Assuming that there is some "geek" crossover in the demographic you are describing, it is pretty clear that people are taking the bait. Considering that 'current D&D player migration' is the focus of the current stage of WOTC's marketing -- on ENworld anyway, things are looking like a big success.

 

[HeavenShallBurn]

This looks more like an attempt to spread fear and rumour, or just an attempt of a poster to look cooler then he actually is...

Well thank you, so nice to be given the benefit of a doubt.

What I saw claimed to be the 4e PHB, it was coming from somewhere in China by the origin. Was it? Looked like it, included recognizable artwork we've seen in previews. But was also largely illegible from bad scanning and playing host to 3 trojans as well. So I'll admit it could just be a piece of bait, but it looks like the real thing based on what's been seen so far. And I've seen scans of 3e stuff that were genuine despite being that bad.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Your first paragraph is not exactly true. A lot of sci-fi fans are resistent to mainstream advertising because they hold disparaging opinions of sports, hollywood movies or other mainstream pop-culture artifacts.

This does not make them 'smarter' or more 'discriminating'. Sci-fans will buy exaclty what you sell them if you market to their own predispositions. Not being the target demographic of specific ad, is different than being too smart for mass marketing in general. People on these boards who thank that they are just that smart are deluding themselves.

In fact, look at these very boards. WOTC's "3 nibbles" a week preview strategy for 4e is absolutely DOMINATING discussion on these boards. A few weeks ago people were disdainful of 4e marketing, now they are consumed with speculation and discussion about this tidbit or that. Assuming that there is some "geek" crossover in the demographic you are describing, it is pretty clear that people are taking the bait. Considering that 'current D&D player migration' is the focus of the current stage of WOTC's marketing -- on ENworld anyway, things are looking like a big success.

I like to think I am not persuaded by marketing. But if I was not, why did corporations spend so much money on it? Does only marketing for marketing work? Am I really that smart?

And when I look at the 4E marketing, I am pretty convincend that it is a lot more effective then people give it credit for. The fans are using the tidibts that are supposedly too few and disappointing to create incredibly resources like the PHB Lite, ready for consumption for anyone that accidently stumbles on the topic of 4E. And most of the posters - even those that say they probably won't play 4E, at least not for long - still have the books pre-ordered!

 

[ki11erDM]

As mentioned in a lot of posts already the only way to ‘fight’ piracy is to give people the chance to get the item in the form they want at a reasonable price.

But what I haven’t seen mentioned is the HUGE problem WoTC has as a company right now as they are stuck between the future and the past. They are beholden to local game stores that still represent a massive part of their market and if they move to fast towards digital distribution they will destroy that aspect of their market. And if they move to slow people will just turn to piracy. I don’t think most of you see how truly difficult the road ahead will be for them to navigate.

They are starting down that path with the DDI as a tool they will use to move people away from game shops and get people use to playing pen & paper D&D online. Once they have a large enough market that they know they can count on without having to use game shops to push their product I think you will see a move to full digital. Not till then.

As an aside, the ONLY use I have for PDFs is to search for rules questions… which the DDI will do just fine for me (or so they say) so I am darn happy. You young people with good eyes might be able to stand to read 400 pages of text on a monitor but I sure as heck have no desire to do that : )

 

[Nytmare]

When I started getting the first little tidbits of 4th Ed last year, I was very excited about what I thought WOTC's plan was going to be involving digital properties. Based off that early information, especially the rumors that you got a free pdf of every physical book you bought, it appeared as though WOTC had embraced the idea that a book released in this day and age, and the information therein, was basically public domain. What I thought they were moving towards was the concept of digital, server side, properties that you got access to when you purchased a D&D book, that were tied into a character builder via the Digital Game Table. The physical books cost you money, and there were special online toys that you could only use if you bought the book, but the information in the books would be basically free to anyone who wanted to use it.

Piracy isn't going to get less common as time goes by, especially since our society is becoming more and more comfortable with free, open access to information. My personal opinion is that most attempts at copy protection and prevention on electronic properties are a complete waste, and that the time and energy would be better spent packaging the purchased products with real life, or virtual feelies.

Three dimensional printers will be available to the public, at a reasonable price, in the relatively near future. I think that the moment the general public is able to download a coffee cup, or a picture frame, or a part for their car, that our society is going to have to take a step back and re-examine the rules and expectations we have regarding physical and intellectual properties and capitalism in general.

Was there a lot of piracy of 3rd edition? Yes. Will there be a lot of piracy of 4th edition? Yes. Will it be a problem? I sincerely doubt it.

 

[Vaeron]

I've already preordered the Core Rules gift set... But if a pdf becomes available I'll definitely grab that too. I'm not sure what the law is regarding having digital copies of something you actually purchased, but having pdf's is insanely handy. I have a physical copy of RoTee, and a digital copy that I can snag maps and pictures from for online mapping/online gaming platforms. Very handy to just flash the PCs a picture or a map, especially for combat.

If it is, in fact, illegal to possess pdfs of products even if you actually have phsically purchased them, then I hope WoTC will offer an online content availability through D&D Insider somehow to their customers.

 

[Belphanior]

Unless you're downloading a hosted file (which is unlikely), you're probably sharing it in the very moment you download it (if you use current file-sharing, which is likely).

Although I'm unwilling to share details on "how to pirate D&D material 101" for obvious reasons, you'll have to trust me when I say that:
a. You're wrong with both your statements.
b. I didn't share it with anyone, 100% guaranteed.