Planar Beings and the Material Plane

[nikolai]

I'm interested in adding a planar theme to my campaign. Not so much as a long term campaign on the planes, but more of planar being attempting to influence the material plane and maybe short trips to the planes as a result. (as a side note with 3.5e the planes are now OGC, which is interesting)

My problem is the Manual of the Planes give a very good introduction to planar geography, but doesn't give a very good idea of what fiends, genies, elementals and other planar creature want and how (and why) they interact with the material plane.

So what do they want on the material plane? The more I think about it the more I can see in some areas no reason for interaction (why should creatures of the Astral or Plane of Earth be interested in the material plane) and on the other hand why the material hasn't been enslaved by more powerful neighbours (why haven't fiends swamped the material, for instance).

I think particularly in 1e this was a pretty big meta-theme for D&D, if someone could enlighten be I'd be grateful.

yours,

nikolai.

 

[BiggusGeekus@Work]

Well, from what I recall, the typical reason that extra-planers were interested in the Prime was "just 'cause".

If it were me and I wanted a strong planar presence in my Prime-based game, I'd say it was because the Prime established the "baseline" for the other planes. So if the Prime becomes excessively good/earth/whatever, then the other planes take a tilt toward good/earth/whatever. I think Planescape had something like this, though my memory fails me on the subject. But in any case, that would give outsiders a very good reason to be interested in the Prime.

 

[Dakkareth]

An obvious reason would be, that the gods derive their power from the believe of their followers. Since most people (people, not outsiders, etc) are on the prime the gods have great interest in the affairs on the prime material plane. And where the gods meddle all others want to meddle, too.

 

[Tabarnak Smokeblower]

The Material Plane, IMO, doesn't offer much to Outsiders.

- Elemental creatures are much more at home on their Home Place.
- Celestials prefer the inherent goodness of their planes (although it is thinkable that a "rogue" celestial could come to the PMP to "convert" sods gone astray).
- Fiends are pretty much occupied by the Blood War, and every group has opponents that won't let the PMP fall into their hands easily. A lone fiend in disguise could try to establish a stronghold in an out-of-place way.
- Astral and Ethereal creatures are pretty much "stuck" on their native plane.

BiggusGeekus: In Planescape, if a particular outer plane (or even a portion thereof) was to have an "alignment drift", then, yes, the plane in question could shift in the direction of its alignment drift. Two examples come to mind (don't remember the actual names). On the plane that is in the middle of the Great Ring of outer planes, there are portal-cities that lead into each Outer Plane. It has happened that the city was absorbed by the Outer Plane when the town became too much like it. The other example is that (IIRC) a part of a LG plane drifted into Mechanus (LN) after some group did something evil.

TS

 

[Sarellion]

In my campaign i said that outer planar beings cannot stay for long on the prime and need a power source or a planar rift to stay.

 

[Malicene]

Hey berks, the thing inside the great ring is the outland ! and futhermore it's the place I lived.
Planar things are for the cunny cutters only ! knowing the dark of it is hard and you could die trying it, Nevertheless always a pleasure giving a clueless sod his first key.
Here is some dark for you :
- At the beginning there was the elemental planes, the inner are the bricks life's made of, but prime world like yours too. This create a gap, and a gap is always filled by something, this is Ethereal, main contact between Inner and Prime material (like yours), many things live there, but I don't know much about it...
- Anyway, once life exist, there was a time when consciousness emerged. From that sentient life (I make it short version) and Faith !
- Faith created the first spiritual plane : Astral , into astral Ideas, Concepts are made real, once religion, churches developped they bring with them a "world for the gods", and from the Astral the great ring was created.

Nice story ?... you like it ? ... but that's not true, an Athar in Sigil would tell you this story ... it suit his way to "feel" the world ...Hum? You don't understand ....

Don't be afraid always the same thing... you'll adapt or die...
Don't forget my garnish, 10 jinks .. a fair price.
(Kriggar a bariaur Thoth in Sigil)

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ok here the chant, the true, the very dark of it :
Planescape ! it's 2nd ed but still the best work ever !
This is the thing to have to understand many many things about Planes (many many books too)

can try :
http://www.ps3e.com/
http://www.mimir.net/
here are two links for most site closed... don't know why

 

[Malicene]

" Hey, Primer I heard what this barmy bariaur told you, He is wrong, the true is that there was the ring, the great ring, and the gods first created the Elements then the Prime world... see the diference ! I hope for you, or go back to your homeworld, this is not a place for you, or you'll have to ...and what about my garnish ...ok I leave you ....."
(Shabalin, Sigil citizen)

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I know this still not answer the question you asked , but that's the way thing goes in the Plane. You always learn thing you don't care, but hardly find what you're looking for.

 

[Malcolm]

There is a war going on…
You feel it because the tides of battle leak over into your world.
Any world. Every world.
It happens when you strike a match.
You can feel it when snowflakes fall on your face.
You can taste it in the dirt when a foe knocks you unconscious.
Its in the breeze that flows through the windows in your house.
Street corner priests call out for you to join,
Some sell peace and sharing, some sell flesh and pain.
Some just watch.
There is a war going on…
You are in it, whether you want to be or not!

To give you a very simple, very short answer to your question: Dominance is the reason for Outsiders to primarily interact with other planes.
Each plane has a “type” you might associate with it; in some cases it is the fundamental nature of the plane physically (the Inner, or Simple, Planes) and in some cases it is the fundamental Spiritual/Mental nature of the plane (the Outer, or Super-Complex, Planes. The Astral, Ethereal, and Shadow are Complex Planes). Creatures native to that type seek to establish more of their “type” across the multi-verse.
A simple example: Fire burns. Its in its nature. Part of this is to spread and create more fire. If left to its own devices, and given enough fuel, it would burn until everything were fire.
A complex example: Mortals (human, elf, etc.) from the Prime Material. When they cross into other dimensions in large quantities they attempt to adapt the environment to match familiar surroundings on the Prime Material.
Conquest, power, and ideological differences fuel the various planar wars; hatred and love are powerful tools for inciting epic battles.
The Prime Material is the melting pot of the Planes. It combines the attributes of the Inner Planes, has the qualities of the Complex Inner Planes, and shares the ideologies of the Outer Planes. The worshipper factor of the Prime is no more or less important than the worshipper factor on the other planes, infinite is infinite.
Many factors contribute to the Prime as being the central battleground for all of the planes: 1.) Ease of access to other planes 2.) Ease of dealing with natives 3.) Safety (die there and its just a penalty box time out before you’re back in the game) 4.) Fast Power – with plenty of foes (including many who are unprepared to fight you) to pick and choose from, the path of Glory, power, and wealth are more easily found than on one’s own home plane.
So for the lil guy there is the chance of rising up the hierarchy of power in their own plane for deeds they do on others. For the Planar heads themselves (Gods) there is the chance to spread their own agenda, and to destroy the patterns of their enemies.