Playtest - Hobgoblin Warlord Sushi Party

[ren1999]

The Hobgoblin Warlord and her Consorts live here. There is a feast and you, the party, are the main course. Prepare to die.

I dropped the warlord's combat advantage because she was getting more hits. The DwarfFighter and the Warlord were fairly evenly matched which drew out combat after the warlord wacked every other party member inside of 2 rounds.

Please note all the misses.

Hobgoblin Consort 4's LongSword vs ac+sit mod:+0=21 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a hit! HalflingRogue takes 6 points damage leaving 10 hit points.
Hobgoblin Consort 2's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=13 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Consort 1's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=13 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a miss!
HalflingRogue's Dagger vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs Hobgoblin Consort 4's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=7 vs Hobgoblin Consort 2's 15 is a miss!
ElfWizard's ShockingGrasp +2 sit mod if target wears armor vs dex+sit mod:+2=23 vs Hobgoblin Consort 3's 11 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 3 takes 13 points damage leaving -2 hit points.
MoradinCleric's Warhammer vs ac+sit mod:+0=14 vs Hobgoblin Consort 4's 15 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs MoradinCleric's 18 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Consort 4's LongSword vs ac+sit mod:+0=23 vs MoradinCleric's 18 is a hit! MoradinCleric takes 5 points damage leaving 12 hit points.
Hobgoblin Consort 2's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs ElfWizard's 11 is a hit! ElfWizard takes 5 points damage leaving 11 hit points.
Hobgoblin Consort 1's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=10 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a miss!
HalflingRogue's Dagger vs ac+sit mod:+0=16 vs Hobgoblin Consort 2's 15 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 2 takes 7 points damage leaving 4 hit points.
ElfWizard's ShockingGrasp +2 sit mod if target wears armor vs dex+sit mod:+2=28 vs Hobgoblin Consort 2's 11 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 2 takes 14 points damage leaving -10 hit points.
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=12 vs Hobgoblin Consort 1's 15 is a miss!
MoradinCleric's Warhammer vs ac+sit mod:+0=13 vs Hobgoblin Consort 4's 15 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=19 vs MoradinCleric's 18 is a hit! MoradinCleric takes 21 points damage leaving -9 hit points.
Hobgoblin Consort 4's LongSword vs ac+sit mod:+0=17 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a hit! HalflingRogue takes 6 points damage leaving 4 hit points.
Hobgoblin Consort 1's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=14 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a miss!
ElfWizard's ShockingGrasp +2 sit mod if target wears armor vs dex+sit mod:+2=13 vs Hobgoblin Consort 1's 11 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 1 takes 9 points damage leaving 2 hit points.
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=17 vs Hobgoblin Consort 1's 15 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 1 takes 17 points damage leaving -15 hit points.
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=10 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Consort 4's LongSword vs ac+sit mod:+0=22 vs HalflingRogue's 15 is a hit! HalflingRogue takes 9 points damage leaving -5 hit points.
ElfWizard's ShockingGrasp +2 sit mod if target wears armor vs dex+sit mod:+2=13 vs Hobgoblin Consort 4's 11 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 4 takes 10 points damage leaving 1 hit points.
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=17 vs Hobgoblin Consort 4's 15 is a hit! Hobgoblin Consort 4 takes 17 points damage leaving -16 hit points.
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=10 vs ElfWizard's 11 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+2=10 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=15 vs ElfWizard's 11 is a hit! ElfWizard takes 14 points damage leaving -3 hit points.
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+2=17 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+2=27 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a hit! Hobgoblin Warlord takes 18 points damage leaving 57 hit points.
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=8 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=10 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=9 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=9 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=10 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=15 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=17 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=24 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a hit! DwarfFighter takes 9 points damage leaving 11 hit points.
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a miss!
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=11 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a miss!
DwarfFighter's GreatAxe vs ac+sit mod:+0=26 vs Hobgoblin Warlord's 20 is a hit! Hobgoblin Warlord takes 15 points damage leaving 42 hit points.
Hobgoblin Warlord's Spear vs ac+sit mod:+0=18 vs DwarfFighter's 15 is a hit! DwarfFighter takes 11 points damage leaving 0 hit points.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I appreciate what you are trying to do here, but I'm only seeing a wall of text!

It would make a more interesting and useful post if you were to write a short narrative about the event; you will probably get more discussion that way too

Cheers

 

[Walking Dad]

But not only the narrative, please.

 

[Cobalt Meridian]

Is this the output from an Excel macro or something? If so it's quite interesting as a number crunching excercise. Otherwise it's not particularly useful for ascertaining how the characters were in play.

 

[ren1999]

Is this the output from an Excel macro or something? If so it's quite interesting as a number crunching excercise. Otherwise it's not particularly useful for ascertaining how the characters were in play.

It's only number crunching for now. There don't seem to be many player options yet. If you want a narrative summary, I can get that too.

NARRATIVE

The DwarfFighter has some effective and damaging hits but that's just about all he can do. I didn't play-test the fact that he does strength modifier damage if he misses. I think the people reviewing my play-test need to know that I'm just not going to allow free damage if the players around me won't accept death by automatic damage without getting a chance to roll anything. I never allowed half-damage or free damage to adjacent enemies in 4th edition and I won't allow it when 5th edition comes out.

If the Shocking Grasp spell is being cast incorrectly it is because we are taking a bunch of rules and trying to make sense of them from the "How to Play" material.
We can't figure how a spell is cast versus armor class so I made a decision to make it versus dexterity. Sure you can't dodge a lightning bolt, but armor isn't going to protect you from a lightning bolt either. The Wizard gets a +2 to hit if the monster is wearing armor so it doesn't make sense that the monster should defend by way of armor.
We figured out that Shocking Grasp is a "minor evocation" which according to an EN World person here means the Wizard can cast it at-will. Thank the gods, because using that Quarterstaff would have made the Wizard even more ineffective than he already is.

The Halfling Rouge is all but useless. If he manages to get advantage, which is rare with so many monsters around, his Sneak Attack is pretty effective. If you look at the number crunching above, he went down fast.

The Cleric just has Warhammer and manages to hit as often as the Dwarf Fighter. Looking at Caves of Chaos here, there really is nothing but combat encounters to test. Couldn't figure out how to heal other party members during the encounter. Death's Door was to stabilize characters after going below 0. But by that time, the cleric didn't waste any healing moves because he was fighting for his life.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Many misses is good for the game, if you don´t have dailies and encounters that need to hit to make a fun game.

It is a lot easier for the DM to keep track of many monsters, if you have less hp overall and a monster goes down in about two solid hits.

I actually do like damage on a miss. It just means, that you really are a good fighter.
You are right however, that not beeing able to do something about it could be hard. Why not allow a saving throw against miss damage, if it would drop you below zero? Would that help?

You should however not complain about the cleric hitting as often and hitting as often as the fighter and not taking into account that the fighter (with the slayer theme of course) should contribute even when he does not hit.

 

[FireLance]

I think the hobgoblin warlord has the highest AC in the playtest, and normal hobgoblins also have above-average AC, so the spate of missing is quite understandable.

I didn't play-test the fact that he does strength modifier damage if he misses. I think the people reviewing my play-test need to know that I'm just not going to allow free damage if the players around me won't accept death by automatic damage without getting a chance to roll anything.

Doesn't that kind of miss the point of the playtest? Oh well, the combat balance between the PCs and the monsters isn't the key issue being playtested here, anyway.

If the Shocking Grasp spell is being cast incorrectly it is because we are taking a bunch of rules and trying to make sense of them from the "How to Play" material.

For the record, when you cast shocking grasp against a target wearing medium or heavy metal armor, you have advantage, so you roll twice and take the better result.

We can't figure how a spell is cast versus armor class so I made a decision to make it versus dexterity.

Spells that have attacks rolls target AC. This appears to be how 5e intends to simplify defenses.

Looking at Caves of Chaos here, there really is nothing but combat encounters to test.

Only if you approach each challenge as combat. EDIT: See here for my own playtest report.

Couldn't figure out how to heal other party members during the encounter.

The cleric of Moradin has healing word. It doesn't heal much, though (the cleric of Pelor's cure light wounds is better). Healing would mostly be done out of combat with healer's kits during short rests or during long rests.