Please help with Gestalt Cleric/Paladin

[Terwox]

There's undead about, right? Grab a normal mace for the skeletons.

Also if there's undead, using undead turning attempts to channel your healing might have some negative consequences, but, with double your normal turning attempts from being cleric/paladin, you're probably fine.

 

[foxwick]

Good ideas - keep 'em coming.

I'm strongly considering Divine Metamagic Persistent Spell in order to cast Visage of the Diety, Lesser daily. +4 CHA and three energy resistences 10 - not bad. Then I can change my Favoured Soul energy resistence to a fourth, which leads me to a question...

If a list of energy types is not provided for a feature/spell, can you use any? The Favoured Soul Energy Resistence class features states, "At 5th level, a favoured soul chooses an energy type and gains resistence 10 against that type." Can I choose negative energy for this?

Using the Visage of the Diety daily allows me to drop my Cloak of Charisma (doesn't stack) too, which is 4000gp I can spend elsewhere.

I'm not convinced on the Power Attack & Divine Might duo. Because we're playing Gestalt, I don't want to assume I'll have attack bonus to spare. And I keep coming back to Smite Evil, which is better than Divine Might, doesn't cost a turning attempt, and since some turning attempts are likely to be used for actual turning and Sacred Healing, I wouldn't be able to use Divine Might many more times than I would Smite Evil.

Point taken on the Mace - I may even have the gold now to get a +1 magic one.

Vigor, Lesser was on my short list for 1st level - I think I dropped it in favour of one of the healing ones (Ray of Resurgence, Touch of Jorasco) - I'll review it.

I'm still waffling on what to do for level and/or ability drain. This is mostly a concern for party members, since my saves are fairly high due to Divine Grace. Death Ward is staying on the spell list for sure, but 8 minutes isn't very long. I saw someone suggest a Wand of Restoration, Lesser in another thread, but I don't see it in the DMG. I suppose scrolls of same are cheap at 150gp, any other ideas?

One option I'm considering with my excess gold at the moment - Sacred Scabbard - thoughts?

 

[Perinon]

One thing to consider if you KNOW there will be a ton of undead is that keen is flat worthless against undead. No crits there, you know. (it's good against the demons and devils n such, but 100% worthless on undead)

Maybe get ghost touch in it's place? I have a personal loathing for fighting ghostly styled undead that give me icky 50% miss chances. (because nothing sucks like smiting and then wiffing the 50/50)

 

[foxwick]

Very good point about Keen - I had already removed it due to someone's Bless Weapon comment, but you raise a good alternative with Ghost Touch.

I'll post a reworked copy tonight.

 

[Thanee]

I'm not convinced on the Power Attack & Divine Might duo.

Even more reason to get them.

Power Attack is far and away the best fighter feat out there.
And Divine Might is just awesome with a high Cha.

Bye
Thanee

 

[IanB]

Smite evil really isn't better than divine might.

Smite will be giving you +6/+8 on a single swing. A use of divine might gives you +0/+6 on every swing you make in a round. If someone in your group casts haste, that could be 3 swings, or 4 if you spend one of your new windfall feats on cleave.

Note also that divine might applies to AOOs you make until your next turn as well.

The keen longsword isn't really optimal, either. Typically you'll get more damage out of throwing a +1d6 energy effect on there, although in this situation I would probably go for either undead bane or evil outsider bane.

 

[Fieari]

I'd like to mention that a few months ago, there was an elimination vote in order to find out what people thought was the best feat out of the SRD, and Power Attack was definitely in the top three... I think it may have won. I don't remember exactly.

 

[foxwick]

Ok, after lots of re-examination and with all your wonderful input, here's what I've got:

Name: Vale Thunderright
Class: Favoured Soul/Paladin 8
Race: Human
Size: M
Gender: M
Alignment: LG
Deity: Heironeous

Str: 16 +3     Level: 8        XP: 28000
Dex: 12 +1     BAB: +8         HP: 7d10+26 (61)
Con: 14 +2     Grapple: +10     Dmg Red: -/-
Int: 12 +1     Speed: 15'      Spell Res: --
Wis: 12 +1     Init: +1        Spell Save: --
Cha: 24 +7*     AC: 25          Spell Fail: 50%
*Including daily Visage of the Diety, Lesser from Divine Metamagic (Persistent Spell)

       Base  Armor Shld  Dex  Size   Nat  Def  Total
Armor: 10    +10    +4    +1   +0     +0   +1    25
Touch: 11              Flatfooted: 24

       Base  Mod  Misc*  Total
Fort:  +6    +2   +9    +17
Ref:   +6    +1   +9    +16
Will:  +6    +1   +9    +16
*Divine Grace + Vest of Resistance

Weapon                             Attack   Damage  Critical
Sacred Longsword of Holy Surge +1  +13/+8   1d8+4   19-20x2

Languages: Common, Celestial

Class Abilities:
Diety's Weapon Focus (Longsword)
Energy Resistance 10 (Fire)*
Aura of Good (Ex)
Detect Evil (Sp)
Smite Evil (Su) (2/day)
Divine Grace (Su)
Lay on Hands (Su) (54hp/day)
Aura of Courage
Divine Health
Turn Undead (10/day)
Remove Disease (1/week)

*Also have Resistance 10 from Acid, Cold & Electricity - from Visage of the Diety, Lesser

Feats:
Extend Spell
Persisten Spell (Complete Arcane)
Power Attack
Divine Might (Complete Warrior)
Empower Turning (Complete Divine)
Sacred Healing (Complete Divine)
Divine Metamagic (Complete Divine)
Extra Turning

Skills(44)                      Ranks  Mod  Misc  Total
Concentration                   11     +2         +13
Diplomacy                       1      +7   +2    +10
Heal                            8      +1   +2    +11
Knowledge (Arcana)              5      +1         +6
Knowledge (Nobility & Royalty)  1      +1         +2
Knowledge (Religion)            7      +1         +8
Knowledge (The Planes)          1      +1         +2
Sense Motive                    5      +1         +6
Spellcraft                      5      +1   +2    +8

Magic Items
*Sacred Longsword of Holy Surge +1  (10300gp)
Shield, Steel, Heavy +2 (4150gp)
Full Plate +2 (4150gp)
Vest of Resistance +2 (4000gp) (Complete Arcane)
Gauntlets of Ogre Power (4000gp)
Wand of Cure Moderate Wounds (20 charges) (1800gp)
Potion of Barkskin +2 (300gp)
Scroll of Remove Paralysis (150gp)
Scroll of Neutralize Poison (375gp)
Scroll of Remove Blindness/Deafness (375gp)
Scroll of Remove Curse (375gp)

*Sacred (Libris Mortis), Holy Surge (DMG II) - This baby is good-aligned, get +1d6 vs undead, 2d6 vs evil outsiders and 7/day get +2d6 vs evil

Other Equipment of Note (besides endless other mundane stuff)
Mace
Antitoxin (vial) (3)
Holy water (flask) (3)
Healer's kit (10 uses)
Holy Symbol, silver
Rope, Silk

Spells (Favoured Soul):

Level 0 (8 known, 6/day)
Create Water
Detect Magic
Detect Poison
Light
Read Magic
Mending
Cure Minor Wound
Guidance

Level 1 (6 known, 8/day)
Bless
Divine Favour
Shield of Faith
Nimbus of Light (Complete Divine)
Protection from Evil
Touch of Jorasco (Races of Eberron)

Level 2 (5 known, 8/day)
Augury
Consecrate
Spiritual Weapon
Sheltered Vitality (Libris Mortis)
Tyche's Touch (Lost Empires of Faerun)

Level 3 (4 known, 7/day)
Searing Light
Protection from Negative Energy (Libris Mortis)
Holy Storm (Planar Handbook)
Mantle of Good (Planar Handbook)

Level 4 (3 known, 4/day)
Visage of the Deity, Lesser (Complete Divine)
Death Ward
Recitation (Complete Divine)

Spells Memorized (Paladin):
Level 1: Restoration, Lesser (2)

This guy is fairly stacked now - thanks for all the help everyone!

His weaknesses are his speed and the low touch AC - both of which are minimized by the high AC and crazy saves and resistances. I'll be casting Shield of Faith for an extra +3 deflection AC too.

I suppose his biggest concern is touch or area spells with no saves. But is there anything that can be done about those?? The Mantle of Good spell will help if the spell is evil and allows SR, but that's all he's got for those situations.