PrC requirements and the Half-Fiend template

[Jon Potter]

Question- When a Prestige Class has the requirement: "Able to cast 2nd level spells", does a creature meet the requirements if they have the Spell-like Ability to cast 2nd level spells or do they actually have to have the requisite clerical levels.

Example- As DM, I've got a Half-Fiend/Half-Orc creature that can (because of the Half-Fiend template) cast Desecrate, a 2nd level Divine spell. I would like to add some levels in Divine Agent from Manual of the Planes which has as one of its requirements: "Able to cast 2nd level divine spells". Assuming that my Half-Fiend meets the other requirements for the PrC, is he ready to start taking levels?

Any help is appreciated.

 

[Li Shenron]

When a Prestige Class has the requirement: "Able to cast 2nd level spells", does a creature meet the requirements if they have the Spell-like Ability to cast 2nd level spells or do they actually have to have the requisite clerical levels.

I would have said no, but I in a previous thread everyone had convinced me that a spell-like ability count as an equivalent prerequisite for the purpose of qualifying for a Prestige Class.

It seems here that your Half-Orc would meet all prereq. even without having a single level in a base class! Although that's usually forbidden by the rules (as far as I know), I don't think it's going to spoil your game. But at least I wouldn't let him get the 1st level benefits (such as full HP and 4x skill points) from the PrCl.

 

[drnuncheon]

Personally, I wouldn't count the ability to cast desecrate as fulfilling the requirement that you be able to cast 2nd level divine spells - you'd need either levels in a divine spellcasting class, or 'casts as a 3rd (or greater) cleric/druid/whatever'.

I would certainly count the ability if the PrC had the requirement 'ability to cast desecrate', but to me 'ability to cast 2nd level spells' implies actual spellcasting progression, not just the ability to cast a single spell.

So, if I were the DM, I'd say 'put the levels in cleric'. It would also seem to fit thematically with the divine agent PrC - you need that connection with your deity of choice to become that close to them.

J

 

[Jon Potter]

Well... thanks for responding.

That's one for and one against so I guess I'm back where I started.

My gut feeling is to err on the side of caution and go with drnuncheon's suggestion. I'm not too happy about giving him Cleric/Druid/what-have-you levels, however. He's really not the spellcasting type.

So maybe I'll go with FR's Divine Champion instead.

Thanks again.

 

[Balgus]

the same goes for Gnomes. there are PrC (i dont remember which) that stated that you had to be able to cast 0 level spells. and the cantrips of the gnome race does count as a qualifying factor.

But if i had to make a call- I would have definitely said NO. being able to cast a specific spell is totally different from having an ability that mimics the spell.

EX- to be able to do a ritual, you must be abel to cast STONESKIN on a person. That is completely different from a Medussa using her Gaze attack and turning someone to stone. technically, they fit the requirement (turning the person's skin into stone), but realistically, it is nowhere near the same thing.

 

[Dingleberry]

the same goes for Gnomes. there are PrC (i dont remember which) that stated that you had to be able to cast 0 level spells. and the cantrips of the gnome race does count as a qualifying factor.

I agree that a gnome's racial cantrips work to satisfy an "ability to cast spells" prereq, because gnomes actually cast the cantrips (PHB page 17: "these are arcane spells"). This is different from a gnome's ability to speak with (burrowing) animals, which is a spell-like ability - just as a half-fiend's casting of desecrate is a spell-like ability.

Therefore, to the original question posed, I say no. Half-fiends do not cast the desecrate spell. Rather, it is a spell-like ability, and spell-like abilities (according to page 7 of the MM and page 13 of MMII) "are not spells".