Premature Death of a BBEG

[Burne]

I like the idea of the dead bloke being another dominated chump, best used after the party is jailed/run out of town and they can get a friendly mocking note on "My plans will be much better now that you are gone, mwhahahah"

Second, if in the opinion of the Church/city the PC's broke the law, have them tried and convicted and the punishment is to pay for a Resurrection (Heck a true resurrection) the return of all stolen goods and Xgp for pain and suffering. This assumes that the BBEG didn't do much other than cast a feeblemind and then teleport away twice. Having the PC pay to bring the BBEG back to life would be very rat-bastardly. And on the PC's side they have foiled his plan for this city, but the BBEG lives to plot another day.

Would love to know if you decided to use any of these ideas.

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

I'm also a big fan of repercussions.

What's the Churches policy on mis-use of magic? Because whilst the players may have attacked a man in the church from diguise, the evil BBEG was also misusing magic. So think about the consequences for both parties.

If the BBEG does die, then face up to the fact that you allowed the PC's to defeat his nondetection, and so you have to deal with that. If you hadn't agreed that they could use his blood, he wouldn't have been found. I like the idea of the detect magic at the door, but do they cast that every time someone comes to the door? Whew! That's a lot of spells, potentially.

Finally, I'd say that if he bites the dust - so what? The players (hopefully) don't know that he's the current BBEG. Make a new one! Make him nastier! Make this guy look like a mere pawn in his schemes of incredible nastiness!

 

[Kesh]

While filming Babylon 5, the creator had certain plotlines centered around a certain character. However, when that character's actor left the show suddenly, he was in a bind. As a solution, he created a brand new character, introduced her, and moved all those new plotlines onto this character.

You can do the same thing. Perhaps the BBEG had a henchman or a rival who can now usurp his position/power/plans. The characters will have a brief calm before this new threat (which they don't even know about) picks up with the plot points you want to continue.

 

[paulewaug]

I agree with Kesh,
Having some Other BBEG pick up the plan or something along the same idea and run with it.
"Evil is as Evil does..."

hehe

maybe the BBEGuys were old friends or rivals, or relatives. Maybe the new BBEG wasn't even evil Until he heard about the death of his friend/lover/relative and has become twisted by thoughts of revenge.

 

[Jeph]

Have the new guy be reincarnated as some freaky little fuzzy thing. Just for a change of pace.

"Aww, look ad da fuzzy wuzzy iddle biddle squirliepoo--"

"HADOKEN!"

 

[Centaur]

Thanks to all for the input.

I think the biggest thing that comes to mind when thinking about this situation is the players lack of fear of the Church in our gamming group. Plenty of times PCs have hatched plans to attack someone inside a church. I almost every case, they have been not so subtly told that such an action would not be a good idea and they eventualy backed off.

I this case, I warned them that there could be consequences and even had the NPC cleric stay out of the fight. Now I think it is time to show the Players that when they mess with a major (or even a minor) church/religion, there are penalties to be paid.

I belive it safe to outline my plan here as currently, none of my players, to the best of my knowledge, read anything on this site. However, if one of you do read this site, please stop reading now and tell me that you did, I'll award you a nice experience bonus for your honesty.

When last we played, 3 members of the part had just teleported (via the help of an NPC) into a high class restaurant and assaulted what appeared to be a "Lady of Station" in front of a number of influencia witnesses who were none to pleased to have their dinners interupted. One of these people was the captain of the city guard.

Certain members of the city's command structure were aware of the goings on in the last couple of days, but the city guard was kept in the dark as evidence suggested that elements in it had been compromised.

The Guard captain will now step into this situation and prevent anyone from looting the body or leaving the scene (unless they want to be introuble with the the law). He will demand that the players and the NPC surrender to his authority until the mater can be delt with. More guards will be summoned and the players led away.

The body and it's possessions will be taken to the city guards "morgue" untill something can be decided. While all the negotiations, Interogations and such are happening, members of the angered church (who also hold considerable political pull in the city) will demand that given the nature of the situation and the violation of the church, the body and the BBEG possessions should be turned over to the church.

The city will capitulate with this demand and compensate the PCs in some other way for saving the city from this menace, but they will be denined the BBEG possessions. In addition, the PCs will be denied access to any and all services available from this church until they make ammends for their actions. Needless to say, ammends will be quite risky, very dangerous and without reward. For proper ammends to be made, all Treasure and a portion of XP erned will be reqired sacrificed to the church for the geas/quest to be fullfilled.

Once this is all done, sometime down the road, the PCs will infact learn that the church resurectred the BBEG and send her to a different city so that she would be out of harms way for a time. However, she will return, more powerful and with henchmen and bent on revenge on the PCs.

Should make for an interesting time-line...

Originaly posted by:GMVictory

Option 2: They killed the wrong guy. A sap who was Dominated/Charmed to act like him. BBEG was there, invisibly. A guy like that surely would have detected that he was being scryed and prepared for it.

I love this idea and almost went with it until I came up with this little bit. Course, I still may change my mind, I have until Saturday the 7th to decided the PCs fate, and that of the BBEG.

Of course I still havn't ruled out an all out assault by the members of the church. Wouldn't hurt to teach them a valuable lessen and maybe take out a few of the NPCs that they have become comfortable around. And of course, if it came down to that, the Party NPC cleric will stay out of the fight entirely so as not to spark religious war between his church and that of the goddess of magic. Even if that means the PCs think that he betrayed them. He is their only source of healing.

I might even have the other churhes give the PCs the cold shoulder for a while simply due to their audacity to attack some one inside a church, any church...

Any thoughts?

 

[Kyramus]

1) the church to the goddess of magic will reqquire reparations for attacking someone inside their church. damage to the church, risking the safety of their acolytes, etc. I'd probably say that they also take the dead BBEG as their right, given that he was IN SANCTUARY at their church when the PCs attacked. Make sure the fine is hefty and enought o cover ressurection magic. They bring BBEG back. BBEG is wiser now and will use more illusions. He might even kill someone and make it look like him, thus throwing pc's off his tracks temporarily.

2) BBEG IS a pawn, the real one is still out there. After seeing the PCs in action, he's taking notes to figure on a good combination of assassins that will prey on their weak points. Have the Real BBEG have an amulet of proof against detection. Makes like simpler.

3) Have BBEG hire someone to make a couple of Simulacrums of him. Another diversionary tactic.

4) BBEG is actually reincarnated as a child, he's been using illusion to get out of the house at night to not alert "his" parents and does his deeds. Makes for a hartbreaker since after the PCs defeat him, they now have the church and angry parents to contend with. Won't it be really bad if the parents petition the church to the goddess of magic to help them bring the PC's to justice? ehehhehehehe

 

[Mark]

Yup. Bigger BBEG comes after the PCs to get back the stuff from his minion and enforce the will of the goddess for their transgressions in her temple...perhaps a Geas/Quest. And while you're at it, have the new top-BBEG retrieve the body of the failed BBEG and raise that bastard. But here's a twist, don't let him come back as a EG. Have him thrown out of the fold and become an NPC that will now help the PCs against the new BBEG in some way. This way the players aren't overly penalized for succeeding, which they did.

 

[Judas]

Re: Thanks to all for the input.

I think the biggest thing that comes to mind when thinking about this situation is the players lack of fear of the Church in our gamming group. Plenty of times PCs have hatched plans to attack someone inside a church. I almost every case, they have been not so subtly told that such an action would not be a good idea and they eventualy backed off.

I this case, I warned them that there could be consequences and even had the NPC cleric stay out of the fight. Now I think it is time to show the Players that when they mess with a major (or even a minor) church/religion, there are penalties to be paid.

I belive it safe to outline my plan here as currently, none of my players, to the best of my knowledge, read anything on this site. However, if one of you do read this site, please stop reading now and tell me that you did, I'll award you a nice experience bonus for your honesty.

When last we played, 3 members of the part had just teleported (via the help of an NPC) into a high class restaurant and assaulted what appeared to be a "Lady of Station" in front of a number of influencia witnesses who were none to pleased to have their dinners interupted. One of these people was the captain of the city guard.

Certain members of the city's command structure were aware of the goings on in the last couple of days, but the city guard was kept in the dark as evidence suggested that elements in it had been compromised.

The Guard captain will now step into this situation and prevent anyone from looting the body or leaving the scene (unless they want to be introuble with the the law). He will demand that the players and the NPC surrender to his authority until the mater can be delt with. More guards will be summoned and the players led away.

The body and it's possessions will be taken to the city guards "morgue" untill something can be decided. While all the negotiations, Interogations and such are happening, members of the angered church (who also hold considerable political pull in the city) will demand that given the nature of the situation and the violation of the church, the body and the BBEG possessions should be turned over to the church.

The city will capitulate with this demand and compensate the PCs in some other way for saving the city from this menace, but they will be denined the BBEG possessions. In addition, the PCs will be denied access to any and all services available from this church until they make ammends for their actions. Needless to say, ammends will be quite risky, very dangerous and without reward. For proper ammends to be made, all Treasure and a portion of XP erned will be reqired sacrificed to the church for the geas/quest to be fullfilled.

Once this is all done, sometime down the road, the PCs will infact learn that the church resurectred the BBEG and send her to a different city so that she would be out of harms way for a time. However, she will return, more powerful and with henchmen and bent on revenge on the PCs.

Should make for an interesting time-line...

Originaly posted by:GMVictory

Option 2: They killed the wrong guy. A sap who was Dominated/Charmed to act like him. BBEG was there, invisibly. A guy like that surely would have detected that he was being scryed and prepared for it.

I love this idea and almost went with it until I came up with this little bit. Course, I still may change my mind, I have until Saturday the 7th to decided the PCs fate, and that of the BBEG.

Of course I still havn't ruled out an all out assault by the members of the church. Wouldn't hurt to teach them a valuable lessen and maybe take out a few of the NPCs that they have become comfortable around. And of course, if it came down to that, the Party NPC cleric will stay out of the fight entirely so as not to spark religious war between his church and that of the goddess of magic. Even if that means the PCs think that he betrayed them. He is their only source of healing.

I might even have the other churhes give the PCs the cold shoulder for a while simply due to their audacity to attack some one inside a church, any church...

Any thoughts?

Why not use BOTH ideas? Instead of the church getting the possesions, the REAL BBEG turns up to reclaim items given to his pawn, posing as a family member or next of kin type. You could even have him "innocently" run into the pc group and ask for directions, all the while the pc's have no clue as to the importance of who they just talked to.

 

[Zenon]

Note to a BBEG's who are wizards:

Learn this spell!

From the SRD:

Detect Scrying
Divination
Level: Brd 4, Sor/Wiz 4
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 120 ft.
Area: 120-ft.-radius emanation centered on the character
Duration: 24 hours
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
The character immediately becomes aware of any attempt to observe the character by means of clairaudience/clairvoyance or scrying. The spell’s effect radiates from the character and moves as the character moves. The spell also reveals the use of crystal balls or other magic scrying devices. The character knows the location of every magical sensor within the spell’s area.
If the scrying attempt originates within the area, the character also knows its location. If the attempt originates outside this range, the character and the scrier immediately make opposed Scry skill checks (a creature without the Scry skill can make an Intelligence check). If the character at least matches the scrier’s result, the character gets a visual image of the scrier and a sense of the scrier’s direction and distance from the character (accurate to within one-tenth the distance).

24 hr duration. Moves with caster. Auto aware of any scry sensors within 120' of you (subject to anything that limits Detect spells like walls, doors, etc). Chance to see who's scrying on you in return. Chance to pass on mis-information because you know someone's watching:

BBEG's Detect Scry alarm goes off as he's talking to his henchman!

BBEG makes prearrainged signal to henchman of Scrying, like twirling a mustache end, etc. and begins speaking in mid-sentence: "...this one last thing and no one will be able to stop me! All I have to do it meet with Mr. X at the Prancing Pony Inn at midnight to seal the deal!" Keeps blathering like this until scry runs out.

Then set up a pasty to take the fall at the Prancing Pony Inn, perferably someone whose death will spell trouble if the PC's are responsible.