Previews for April and Beyond

I guess you should retire the characters at 20th level then, because it kind of is hard to say that the PC's should never meet gods when they are demigods themselves (or at the very least no longer mortal).

They won't be demigods on my games at 21+. Epic, yes, strong, yes, demigods, nope.

There's a lot of mundane monsters on MM for them to face until level 30.

No offense, but I'm not suggesting how you should play your game or DM your world so I'm respectfully asking you don't tell me what I should do... being there, done that, no gods talking to my players and everybody had fun... ;)

Gods in my games are not like D&D gods, no matter what edition, use to be.
 

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They won't be demigods on my games at 21+. Epic, yes, strong, yes, demigods, nope.

There's a lot of mundane monsters on MM for them to face until level 30.

No offense, but I'm not suggesting how you should play your game or DM your world so I'm respectfully asking you don't tell me what I should do... being there, done that, no gods talking to my players and everybody had fun... ;)

Gods in my games are not like D&D gods, no matter what edition, use to be.
So you're not allowing the Demigod epic destiny? :D

I have no problem with the Raven Queen showing up (and I want to see a larger version of THAT picture, like, NOW!), but I'd prefer if she remained silent and allowed one a sorrowsworn seneschal or exarch do the talking. That's what exarchs are for, no?
 

I'm disallowing the Demigod ED myself, mainly because I don't like the mechanics (promotes SAD and has boring mechanics before lvl 30 despite being very powerful) but also because I don't see the fluff working this way unless something specific happens in game (like my players finding some fountain of divinity).

And I'll agree with not talking with Gods. I'd have an exarch at best, probably just an immortal champion talk for the Raven Queen, with a gravely choruse praising her constantly. Maybe after all pertinent discussion she would say something meaningful and prophetic, but that is not interaction. Maybe at level 30 I'd allow players to interact with a god more directly.
 

Maybe my game preferences are somewhat different from most D&D gamers but as a player or master one thing that would cut all the fun and belief in campaign is a god talking to players asking for a favor or starting a quest.

Gods should talk to players only by angels, by creatures (a raven in that case) or as a presence on their dreams.

When I'm DMing gods are far more distant beings and have their own distant agendas.

When I'm playing and a god show up all I think is "lame"...

Well, everyone has his preferences, but the way I see it:
This is the epic tier. It's the endgame. Here you take your destiny in your own hands and fulfill it. You have the chance to change your world.

To signify this change, I think personal interaction with gods is as important as meeting powerful leaders at lower tiers. It shows how important you have become to the world, what reach your power and name has.
You're not some random dude with a sword or staff, you're on your route to immortality! People will talk of you in poems, sing ballads about you and hear of your adventures even centuries later! Your deeds will become parts of the myths of the world, just like the god themselves are a part of the myths.

Ideally, after you have reached your epic destiny, the setting book itself should need an update.
"In ancient times, mythic heroes assembled on the court of the Raven Queen to defend the departing souls against Orcus, now called the Imprisoned Lord. They traveled the planes, challenging Orcus most powerful servants and allies and finally defeated Orcus in a battle that is said to take days. His soul was imprisoned by the Raven Queen and these ancient heroes, forever trapping his soul so that neither he nor his raw, abyssal evil could ever threaten the world again.
The Demon Lord of Death had found death himself. His place among the Demon Lords is empty to this day, no Demon daring to take his position, no cultist daring to free him. If this should ever come to pass, these heroes will inevitably return to the mortal world, to strike down whoever was foolish enough to try."


(Of course, I am not convinced yet that this is how the campaign will end, but that would be the direction I'd take.)

If I don't want to meet gods in D&D 4, I probably wouldn't play the Epic Tier, or at least create a setting without gods. The gods in a pantheon are basically human(oid)s, they are not abstract concepts like Death or Justice.


An alternative way might to say that the meeting is still merely with an Exarch, Avatar or Angel of Raven Queen that is created in her image.
 

I'm of the opinion that if mighty heroes interacting with the gods (and even almost slaying them, see Achilles/Scamander) is good enough for Homer, then it is good enough for my game. :)
 

Well it depends with how you treat gods in your game, doesn't it? Eberron gods are distant. My campaign has multiple religions, some are ideas with a few immortals serving them, some have actual deities that willingly interact with mortals (and can be killed by them) and some have powerful and distant beings, which contact worshippers in dreams. The default setting of D&D seems to have deities that interact with mortals often (and the Raven Queen herself is an ascended mortal, maybe one who has even ascended within the history of some of the primary races of the world).
 

I'm also pondering expanding this, and coming up with some Tomes for Clerics/Avenger/Invokers. I am starting to dig the idea of, say, using the Avenger to replicate the Archivist class from Heroes of Horror (Holding up a holy text and reading an esoteric holy chant to harm a devil, for instance). An Avenger multi-classed/hybrid-ed into Invoker might get that feel, perhaps.

The Preserving invoker comes a lot closer to Archivist than the Avenger does, I think- or am I missing something?
 

Look at the defenses on the green slime: Fortitude 23, Reflex 17, Will 20. Like, whoa. Quite high for a 4th lvl lurker, don't you think?! The DMG suggests that a monster's non-AC defenses be level + 12, and although most monsters in the MM don't follow that advice I don't think I've ever seen deviation to this degree before!
 



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