Level 4 Cavalier-Fighter here. I've got the Protection fighting style which gives you Two weapon fighting. Can you use your shield as your bonus attack? From what I've gathered the shield is considered an improvised weapon and therefore a 1D4. Two weapon fighting allows you to apply your ability modifier. I feel like this should at least be the case. Any help is appreciated
D&D 5E Protection. Sword and board as Two weapon fighting?
Satyrn
First Post
I don't understand what you're saying here. Are you saying you selected the Dual Wielder feat at 4th Level. Are you confusing the bonus action granted by the cavalier's Unwavering Mark feature as two weapon fighting? Are you talking about some other cavalier than the one in Xanathar's, and that grants the two weapon fighting style?
Something else entirely?
Satyrn
First Post
But to answer the thread title's question: I've seen other DMs rule that the shield, as an improvised weapon, deals 1d4 damage ( adding your Str mod of you have the two weapon fighting style)
But - and this is important! - the shield is not a light weapon, so you need the Dual Wielder feat to use it for two weapon fighting.
But - and this is important! - the shield is not a light weapon, so you need the Dual Wielder feat to use it for two weapon fighting.
Is this a house rule? Protection gives you the ability to protect someone else with your shield. It does not give you Two-Weapon Fighting.
You can dual wield like any other character, but you don't add your Strength mod to the off-hand damage.
There is a fair bit of debate about this, and no clear-cut answer. You should ask your DM.
However, even if your DM allows it, it's not going to be very effective. First, per Satyrn, you need the Dual Wielder feat to even attempt this. And then, since you are not proficient with improvised weapons (which are neither simple nor martial), your attack bonus is equal to your Strength modifier and nothing else. You would need the Tavern Brawler feat to get proficiency with improvised weapons.
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
Well, first I don't see how "the Protection fighting style gives you Two weapon fighting"?
To summarize as others have said: You want Two-Weapon Fighting Style (not Protection) so you can add your Strength modifier to damage, Dual Wielder because a Shield is not a light weapon, and Tavern Brawler so you gain your proficiency bonus when using the Shield as an Improvised Weapon.
If you happen to be a human and play the variant race option, you could have this by Level 4. Then you could have a bonus attack with prof bonus + Str mod to attack roll with Shield (1d4+Str mod) damage. You also get a +1 bonus to AC (from Dual Wielder) if your DM allows it (our does). Finally, when you use your Shield to attack you do NOT lose the AC bonus granted by the Shield (this was addressed in SAC) unless your DM rules otherwise.
I have a Dwarf Fighter will all this (he had to wait for 8th level though) and it is pretty awesome.
Hm... as GM I guess I'd allow this (even the +3 AC from stacking shield & dual wielder) given the heavy Feat investment. My problem is that I think a shield 'resembles a club' so I'd be inclined to allow proficiency bonus already, but I'm not so keen on dual wielder feat allowing the shield to give +3 AC as well as a bonus attack - I'd be inclined to say you can have either TWF or shield AC bonus, not both. But add in Tavern Brawler and it seems fair to let the TB feat treat the shield as both shield & weapon, whichever is most favourable.
I made the centaur before Rav was out. It was UA at the time. I was supposed to play just the opening session. 8 months later here we are. Fell in love w the game. Wouldn't mind the rav version though, lol.
Refer to bonus action and reaction for answers to your questions. I had saw the tavern brawler stuff but was hoping for something helping me to do bring this to the dm and be able to do this. I think he'll allow it. We'll see
Refer to bonus action and reaction for answers to your questions. I had saw the tavern brawler stuff but was hoping for something helping me to do bring this to the dm and be able to do this. I think he'll allow it. We'll see
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DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
Well, since I know nothing about rav and don't use D&D Beyond because half the time when other players use it they get "extra" stuff for some strange reason not in the rules. Personally, I avoid D&D Beyond like the plague!
RAW, you won't have Two-Weapon Fighting AND Protection unless you are a Fighter/ (Ranger or Paladin) multiclass or a Fighter (Champion) 11. I am sure there might be other ways, but those are the most direct one. Maybe it is something Centaur's get in D&D Beyond or UA or something? Either way, if you read the Protection description, that doesn't give you Two-Weapon Fighting, as they are independent fighting styles.
RAW, you won't have Two-Weapon Fighting AND Protection unless you are a Fighter/ (Ranger or Paladin) multiclass or a Fighter (Champion) 11. I am sure there might be other ways, but those are the most direct one. Maybe it is something Centaur's get in D&D Beyond or UA or something? Either way, if you read the Protection description, that doesn't give you Two-Weapon Fighting, as they are independent fighting styles.
Tales and Chronicles
Jewel of the North, formerly know as vincegetorix
The ''two-weapon fighting'' entry on Beyond is there for every character; it just means that all character can use their bonus action to do a second attack with their off-hand weapon (given specific restriction), not that you have the ''two weapons fighting style''. That is entirely another thing.
- Shields are on the armor list, not the weapons, so you could attack with it, but it is as useful as attacking with a bar stool or your halfling ally: its an improvised attack.
- So, given that you use the Dual Wielder feat (because without it you CANT use the ''two weapon fighting'' action because it isnt light) you would attack without your Proficiency and deal 1d4 dmg without any str bonus to dmg (though your DM can say that a shield used as an improvised weapon could do more than a 1d4 due to its size).
- To ''dual wield'' a sword n board, you would need:
1)Dual Wielder feat -> so you could use the shield as an Off-Hand non-light improvised weapon.
2) Tavern Brawler feat -> so you can add your Proficency bonus to the off-hand attack with an improvised weapon.
3) Two-Weapon Fighting Style -> so you can add your STR mod to the off-hand attack with an improvised weapon.
That's hard to pull-off in RAW. In my games, I changed the shields (parrying dagger, duel gauntlet, buckler, shield and pavise) to be low damage weapons with a special quality that give a AC bonus. So my player can actually fight with both their sword and shield without requiring all the thing specified above.
- Shields are on the armor list, not the weapons, so you could attack with it, but it is as useful as attacking with a bar stool or your halfling ally: its an improvised attack.
- So, given that you use the Dual Wielder feat (because without it you CANT use the ''two weapon fighting'' action because it isnt light) you would attack without your Proficiency and deal 1d4 dmg without any str bonus to dmg (though your DM can say that a shield used as an improvised weapon could do more than a 1d4 due to its size).
- To ''dual wield'' a sword n board, you would need:
1)Dual Wielder feat -> so you could use the shield as an Off-Hand non-light improvised weapon.
2) Tavern Brawler feat -> so you can add your Proficency bonus to the off-hand attack with an improvised weapon.
3) Two-Weapon Fighting Style -> so you can add your STR mod to the off-hand attack with an improvised weapon.
That's hard to pull-off in RAW. In my games, I changed the shields (parrying dagger, duel gauntlet, buckler, shield and pavise) to be low damage weapons with a special quality that give a AC bonus. So my player can actually fight with both their sword and shield without requiring all the thing specified above.
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