PS3 600 dollars? Sony is on crack

[drothgery]

In theory, though MS never made up for the loss in hardware. MS has consistently posted losses.

And historically, Sony never lost much on hardware, and was making a profit on PS2 hardware within a year or two. No one's ever made money selling consoles at a loss long-term; only Microsoft has ever managed to build marketshare that way, and that's because they have far more ability to eat losses than any other company that's ever played in the console space before.

MS has had one profitable quarter from the Xbox division (when Halo 2 launched), but I suspect it will start consistently showing a profit within a year. Their losses on hardware are more akin to Sony's in the PS2 era than to theirs with the original Xbox (or Sony's expected losses with the PS3), and I suspect once the Xenon gets a die shrink, they'll start showing a small profit on hardware (depending on the pace of price cuts). And there are a lot of big titles that MS is publishing over the next year (most notably Halo 3), as well as Xbox Live subscriptions.

 

[Vigilance]

Will the PS3 do well in Japan? Of course - the Japanese remain highly nationalistic in their purchasing habits so Microsoft is really kidding themselves if they think they'll ever get a foothold there. The Wii is the only console with a chance against the PS3, and it's a snowballs chance in a rather warm place.

Well, MS has sold through their initial run of 800,000 X-Box 360's in Japan, so that's um, a toe hold anyway

The Japanese are very ambivalent toward MS though. I do agree that the Wii is the console with the best chance to challenge the PS3, because it seems firmly targeted at kids, people with lives and people with no pathological need to be on the bleeding edge. Whereas the PS3 has essentially moved itself toward being a more luxury item.

Anytime I can get a desktop PC for less than a console gaming system, that gaming system is in trouble and I suspect I'm not the only one who feels this way. And no, I don't define "trouble" as the sky falling and corporate executives flinging themselves to their deaths. But I do define it as leaving behind the mass market that the PS and PS2 were both able to appeal to so well.

EA Sports and some hunting and fishing games also have done well with this mass market crowd by continuing to support older consoles. Madden was still coming out for the Playstation ONE in 2004 and is still coming out for the gamecube.

Chuck

 

[LightPhoenix]

If the DS vs. PSP sales are any indication, it's the PS3 that may be in trouble in the motherland.

Except that's a bad analogy to the point, since Nintendo and Sony are both Japanese companies. Also, because the handheld and console markets are considerably different.

Now, if Microsoft had a handheld and was kicking butt in Japan, that would be a good analogy. But it will never happen.

 

[Rackhir]

the Japanese remain highly nationalistic in their purchasing habits so Microsoft is really kidding themselves if they think they'll ever get a foothold there. The Wii is the only console with a chance against the PS3, and it's a snowballs chance in a rather warm place.

Nationalisim is highly overated when it comes to the failure of the X-Box in japan. Microsoft succeeded in exterminating the indigenous PC98 series of machines/os from NEC that ruled the market over there as recently as 12-15 yrs ago.

RPGs one of the most popular categories of games in Japan (ever notice how most PS2 rpgs are ports of japanese games) were almost unknown on the orignal x-box.

The massive size of the console, also told against it, a lot of people live in apartments that are tiny by american standards.

Microsoft was in general notably tone deaf in their approach to the japanese market period. If you don't understand the market you are selling to and fail to attract support then you aren't going to succeed period.

The remarkable thing about the X-box and to a somewhat larger extent the 360 is the extent to which they have succeeded. Microsoft historically has failed horribly with at least the first two versions of a product, if not well beyond that. (There are VERY GOOD reasons nobody remembers a version of windows prior to 3.11) To have run even a distant second with their first itteration of a product is a mind boggling success by their standards.

 

[Vigilance]

The remarkable thing about the X-box and to a somewhat larger extent the 360 is the extent to which they have succeeded. Microsoft historically has failed horribly with at least the first two versions of a product, if not well beyond that. (There are VERY GOOD reasons nobody remembers a version of windows prior to 3.11) To have run even a distant second with their first itteration of a product is a mind boggling success by their standards.

Well... I dunno... what they did with the X-box wasn't a startling departure for them product wise. Microsoft had made PC games before, like Age of Empires that sold pretty well... so they basically made a dedicated PC to run games and more games.

Doesn't seem like something a company with MS resources SHOULD have a hard time pulling off.

Chuck

 

[LightPhoenix]

Well... I dunno... what they did with the X-box wasn't a startling departure for them product wise. Microsoft had made PC games before, like Age of Empires that sold pretty well... so they basically made a dedicated PC to run games and more games.

Doesn't seem like something a company with MS resources SHOULD have a hard time pulling off.

I apologize for being nit-picky, but you hit one of my pet peeves. Microsoft did not make AoE, they only published it. Ensemble Studios developed it.

 

[Rackhir]

Well... I dunno... what they did with the X-box wasn't a startling departure for them product wise. Microsoft had made PC games before, like Age of Empires that sold pretty well... so they basically made a dedicated PC to run games and more games.

Doesn't seem like something a company with MS resources SHOULD have a hard time pulling off.

Chuck

You have to remember that Microsoft is in many respect a fundamentally incompetent company. At least half their success is due to the even greater incompetence of their opposition. Most of whom have done more damage to themselves than MS ever managed. If MS hadn't bought Bungie to get their hands on Halo, there's a good chance that they wouldn't have done nearly as well as they did do with the X-Box.

There's a terrific book by Robert X. Cringely called "Accidental Empires" which is a first rate history of Silicon Valley and how it came to be (at least up to the mid-late 90's). The chapter on Microsoft is very enlightening. I can not recomend this book highly enough. It is well written and entertaining enough that the most knowledgeable techy will enjoy it as much as the most technophobic luddite.

 

[Vocenoctum]

Except that's a bad analogy to the point, since Nintendo and Sony are both Japanese companies. Also, because the handheld and console markets are considerably different.

I believe the analogy was to the Wii vs PS3.

 

[Vocenoctum]

The massive size of the console, also told against it, a lot of people live in apartments that are tiny by american standards.

While I don't disagree really, it is funny that size of the console means something, but one of the points of the PS3 is to use with HDTV's. Can't have the big 360, but hook up the (also large size) PS3 to your bigscreen.

 

[Rackhir]

While I don't disagree really, it is funny that size of the console means something, but one of the points of the PS3 is to use with HDTV's. Can't have the big 360, but hook up the (also large size) PS3 to your bigscreen.

Well it is unavoidable that a large TV is going to occupy a large amount of space so it's an unavoidable price to pay if you want that large screen. However the advent of plasma and LCD tvs has considerably reduced the amount of space even a large TV will take up. By contrast there was really no need for the xbox to be as big as it was, especially when compared to the slimline psOne or PStwo. But it is likely that the average size of tvs in Japan is going to be smaller than in the US.