MNblockhead
A Title Much Cooler Than Anything on the Old Site
I've been introducing my two boys (ages 7 and 10) to RPGs, first with Hero Kids, now with D&D 5e. I took my 10 year old to one Adventurer's League game at a convention this past weekend. The day before was just me. At every game I played there were kids, some as young as 6. All of the games were rated "everyone". Also, I'm thinking of running a "Bring Your Kids to D&D" events at one of the FLGS in my area, so I've been thinking a lot about kids and public games.
Below are my unorganized reactions and thoughts. I would be interested in your reactions. You can share your horror stories, that's always fun to read, but please explain what could have been done to avoid or mitigate the issues. If that is "don't allow kids" or "kick out the potty-mouth man-child", explain how a DM should go about doing this at a public event that depends on FLGS support.
1. Post/Read Age Requirements
It seems that a lot of bad feelings can be avoided by setting expectations. There are times that you don't want kids around. I get that. I would not allow anyone under 18 in my monthly at-home game, for example. But if you don't want kids at your game, make that clear. If you don't want to play with kids at the table, check on whether there is an age policy. If not, assume someone may bring their kids.
I also think that some granularity is helpful. At the Con I just attended they had kids-only, kids, teens, and everyone. I guess they didn't want adult-only games. Not sure what their policy was on game content. Overall, it worked well. I can understand not wanting to make it more complicated than that. But if you are running a game at your FLGS, you can and should be more clear on your signs or meetup posts.
For example, I would set a minimum age. It is hard to do this, because kids mature at different rates. But I don't think I would run any game with kids under 8 for a normal 4-hour AL type game (and 10 years may be a better minimum). If I'm running something like Hero Kids, I would say something like ages 6 to 9. I think an upper level is helpful to avoid older kids being frustrated by or dominating the younger ones.
2. Use something like Meetup.com and require sign-up
This allows you to communicate with those signing up, to make sure that they understand that kids are not welcome or that there may be kids playing. It also avoids the issue of parents who just drop their kids off, which can happen when you advertise an event without seat limits and signup.
3. Require minors be accompanied by an adult
With teenagers, this would be silly and establishing an age cutoff can seem arbitrary, but the DM and FLGS are not being paid as babysitters--though DM babysitters may be a business opportunity
. Also, for younger kids, the DM doesn't have much control over the kid. If the parent isn't there and you kick a kid away from the table and something happens to him or her, there could be legal ramifications. This creates a frustrating dynamic at the table. I would, as a DM, refuse to have a minor play without the parent also playing. Requiring signup helps.
4. Bad language and mixed-age public games
You should set language expectations in the game announcement and signup if that is important to you. If, as a parent, you are taking your kid to an all-age, public game, you need to expect that they may be exposed to some "bad words." As a parent, I'm not so much concerned with what they hear. I explain to my kids that there are words people will use that I don't want them to say or that there are ways to speak in some environments that are not acceptable in other environments. If your child is not mature enough to understand this, they probably should not participate in mixed-ages public games. Same goes with violence and scary themes.
Where issues like this arise, I don't think it comes from parents who are gamers themselves. Gamer parents understand the tropes and community norms. Sometimes there are players who are over the top with their language and oblivious to kids being present, but I've not encountered this in gaming. I'm more likely to run into this problem at the barber shop or a restaurant than at a gaming convention.
5. Length of play
For 5-7, I'm thinking 2 hours at most. For 8-11, 4 hours. I would limit 6-8 hour games to players at least 12 years of age. I know it depends on the maturity of the kid. I know adults that can't sit through a 6-hour game and would find even 4 hours to be excessive. Still, I've been annoyed by people taking toddlers to a four-hour game and the rest of the table has to deal with the fidgeting, continuous dropping of dice, messing up table setups, and whining.
As a parent, I think it is rude to sign up for a game unless I am 100% sure my kid can handle it. Otherwise, if my kid has a meltdown and I have to leave with him, the table is down two party members. That's not fair to the other players.
6. Some issues are not age related
Some kids have bad tempers. Some cheat. Some are rude. So are some adults. These should be addressed in pretty much the same way. If you are not a parent and do not have much experience with kids, it may be more difficult to deal with it, but some DMs and players have trouble addressing disruptive behavior regardless of the age of the person causing the problems. With kids, this is why having the parent present is important. Address the issue to the parent. It is their job to parent, not yours.
Some people, kids and adults, have learning disabilities or mental-health challenges. These are the most difficult to deal with. I want to be understanding. I would hate to have to kick someone out of a game because they are disrupting it only to find out they have a mental issue. That can be a crushing experience for the person being "rejected." At the same time, my players and I didn't sign up to be a therapist and are not (at least I'm not) trained to be one.
I'm still thinking about this. The best I can come up with is to state the rules of behavior at sign up and to go over them at the start of the game. If issues arise, you address the behavior, referencing the rules that were set forth earlier.
Anyway, interested in other perspectives. How do (or would) you handle playing with kids in public games?
Below are my unorganized reactions and thoughts. I would be interested in your reactions. You can share your horror stories, that's always fun to read, but please explain what could have been done to avoid or mitigate the issues. If that is "don't allow kids" or "kick out the potty-mouth man-child", explain how a DM should go about doing this at a public event that depends on FLGS support.
1. Post/Read Age Requirements
It seems that a lot of bad feelings can be avoided by setting expectations. There are times that you don't want kids around. I get that. I would not allow anyone under 18 in my monthly at-home game, for example. But if you don't want kids at your game, make that clear. If you don't want to play with kids at the table, check on whether there is an age policy. If not, assume someone may bring their kids.
I also think that some granularity is helpful. At the Con I just attended they had kids-only, kids, teens, and everyone. I guess they didn't want adult-only games. Not sure what their policy was on game content. Overall, it worked well. I can understand not wanting to make it more complicated than that. But if you are running a game at your FLGS, you can and should be more clear on your signs or meetup posts.
For example, I would set a minimum age. It is hard to do this, because kids mature at different rates. But I don't think I would run any game with kids under 8 for a normal 4-hour AL type game (and 10 years may be a better minimum). If I'm running something like Hero Kids, I would say something like ages 6 to 9. I think an upper level is helpful to avoid older kids being frustrated by or dominating the younger ones.
2. Use something like Meetup.com and require sign-up
This allows you to communicate with those signing up, to make sure that they understand that kids are not welcome or that there may be kids playing. It also avoids the issue of parents who just drop their kids off, which can happen when you advertise an event without seat limits and signup.
3. Require minors be accompanied by an adult
With teenagers, this would be silly and establishing an age cutoff can seem arbitrary, but the DM and FLGS are not being paid as babysitters--though DM babysitters may be a business opportunity
. Also, for younger kids, the DM doesn't have much control over the kid. If the parent isn't there and you kick a kid away from the table and something happens to him or her, there could be legal ramifications. This creates a frustrating dynamic at the table. I would, as a DM, refuse to have a minor play without the parent also playing. Requiring signup helps.4. Bad language and mixed-age public games
You should set language expectations in the game announcement and signup if that is important to you. If, as a parent, you are taking your kid to an all-age, public game, you need to expect that they may be exposed to some "bad words." As a parent, I'm not so much concerned with what they hear. I explain to my kids that there are words people will use that I don't want them to say or that there are ways to speak in some environments that are not acceptable in other environments. If your child is not mature enough to understand this, they probably should not participate in mixed-ages public games. Same goes with violence and scary themes.
Where issues like this arise, I don't think it comes from parents who are gamers themselves. Gamer parents understand the tropes and community norms. Sometimes there are players who are over the top with their language and oblivious to kids being present, but I've not encountered this in gaming. I'm more likely to run into this problem at the barber shop or a restaurant than at a gaming convention.
5. Length of play
For 5-7, I'm thinking 2 hours at most. For 8-11, 4 hours. I would limit 6-8 hour games to players at least 12 years of age. I know it depends on the maturity of the kid. I know adults that can't sit through a 6-hour game and would find even 4 hours to be excessive. Still, I've been annoyed by people taking toddlers to a four-hour game and the rest of the table has to deal with the fidgeting, continuous dropping of dice, messing up table setups, and whining.
As a parent, I think it is rude to sign up for a game unless I am 100% sure my kid can handle it. Otherwise, if my kid has a meltdown and I have to leave with him, the table is down two party members. That's not fair to the other players.
6. Some issues are not age related
Some kids have bad tempers. Some cheat. Some are rude. So are some adults. These should be addressed in pretty much the same way. If you are not a parent and do not have much experience with kids, it may be more difficult to deal with it, but some DMs and players have trouble addressing disruptive behavior regardless of the age of the person causing the problems. With kids, this is why having the parent present is important. Address the issue to the parent. It is their job to parent, not yours.
Some people, kids and adults, have learning disabilities or mental-health challenges. These are the most difficult to deal with. I want to be understanding. I would hate to have to kick someone out of a game because they are disrupting it only to find out they have a mental issue. That can be a crushing experience for the person being "rejected." At the same time, my players and I didn't sign up to be a therapist and are not (at least I'm not) trained to be one.
I'm still thinking about this. The best I can come up with is to state the rules of behavior at sign up and to go over them at the start of the game. If issues arise, you address the behavior, referencing the rules that were set forth earlier.
Anyway, interested in other perspectives. How do (or would) you handle playing with kids in public games?
