Putting the Fun Back into Learning the Rules

I honestly think it has something to do with chemistry, which is something that can't be taught. Best example I can think of is my wife (who I often use as examples, but let's face it, she's the gamer whose style I've been able to monitor most closely). She's normally been quite mechanics-agnostic, content to say "What do I need to roll?", but she started perking up when she encountered forced movement rules: first Knockback in Hero system, and then to a much greater extent in 4e. Being able to fire enemies around the map became the trigger for her engaging with the rules enthusiastically.

It may be a similar process for your guys: can there be found something within the rules that is its own carrot? Is there a particular mechanic they enjoy enough that they might look forward to opportunities to apply it, and thus start getting interested in rules mastery? If there isn't an obvious one, is there something that they really enjoy that could reap them mechanical rewards in addition to just plain roleplay enjoyment?
 

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If you present players with highlighted opportunities to use specific skill sets to find solutions to the types of in-game challenges they enjoy - done deal :)
 

One thing you also might do is let them know in game some of the "tricks" of the villian.

"Og-gromok is a brutal ogre, one who loves to wrestle and grapple foes, crushing them with his mighty strength."

They find that out at the end of the session, and are due to face him next time. You suggest it might be good for them to read the one page in the phb on grapple rules so they will know what to expect.



If you provide a "lesson" that they will actually do better in the game if they learn, it might provide incentive for them to learn that rule. If you do it consistently, they might learn a rule or two each session.

Sometimes people don't bother with a task when it seems too big, but when it is broken down for them, it's much easier to address (and can be embarrassing if they don't read the ONE page you asked them to read).
 

Ditto on the timer. It really helps, IME, with both folks who don't look up their issues before their turn and dither on making decisions. Also helps cut down on OOC tabletalk. Personally, I'm not above NPC enemies taking potshots at lagging PCs if it gets things moving, but that tactic can only be used sparingly else resentment results.

I think a cheatsheet is an excellent idea; I use them when I play and DM, though I prep them myself. I've never had a DM who handed out such a thing--though it would have been very nice. There are a lot of PDF-ized cheatsheets for 3.x and 4E D&D covering different issues. I don't know if PF or other games have the same thing. I'm sure putting one together (say, for a race or class's mechanics, basics of battle, skills) wouldn't be much of a chore and would probably help speed things up, esp. if it's 1 page and neatly organized.
 

[MENTION=22779]Hussar[/MENTION]: Thanks for your thoughts here and further up.

I think flat-out skipping someone's turn might be a bit too harsh for me. I'd prefer to go with "your PC delays until you're ready". I should really give that a go.

As for cheatsheets, as I said above, I've already put together a "quick reference sheet" for each PC that has the full text (plus any errata/house rules) for any feats, talents, racial abilities, and the like that the player might need to reference during play. The only thing it doesn't cover is trained skill uses, because that would simply be too much work, especially for a skill monkey PC.

I am also working on making a more generic quick reference sheet that has a number of things like weapon ranges and basic action costs and the like on it (think the handy full-page "actions in combat" chart on page 289 of the 4e PHB; unfortunately, SWSE never got one of those, at least not in the book - there's something similar on the GM screen, which is what I am copying). I'll give each of the PCs a copy of that along with their character sheet.


The thing is, I actually modified the base SWSE character sheet by adding a list of the most common actions with a quick summary and the page number on the left of the front page, and a run-down of all the things you could do with Force Points and Destiny Points on the right ... and so it's right in front of their faces at all times and yet I still find myself having to remind them! I don't think any of them ever actually look at the list I put on the left of the character sheet, although they will look at the FP and DP rules (but usually only if I remind them to do so).
 

How do I go about convincing my players to learn the rules for their characters in such a way that it'll feel less like I'm giving them homework and more like something they actually want to do?

First off, let me say that you're in a prime position as DM if your players don't know the rules. Let your players focus on the story and look to you for help on rules.

You ask them what they want to do, while you're playing, and they tell you. Then, you simply tell them what to roll.

For many DM's, this is a dream situation.





But, that dream situation is not alwasy possible. Most players like to know the rules. They like to know what's possible. And if you're playing a d20 game (or one of the other D&D versions) chances are your players will need to know some of the game rules in order to make good decisions when building their characters (and guiding their characters for prerequisites for future builds).




I was in a similar situation about a year and some months ago. My players were AD&D 2E gamers. Nobody had ever played a 3/3.5 E D&D or d20 game (except one of them played Neverwinter Nights on the PC).

These players were not new to gaming. They had 20+ years of gaming each. But, they were new to the d20 system, which is a big step, in a lot of ways, away from 2E AD&D.

Here's what I did...





First, I picked a game that I knew we'd all like. As GM, I had to be passionate about the universe, and I was ready for something "new". One of my players really doesn't get into anything other than fantasy, so I knew I had to pick a game in that genre. I couldn't go with science fiction or espionage, two of my top picks.

I settled upon the Conan RPG. I'm a huge fan of Conan. The game is fantasy, but it is much different from Tolkien-esque D&D. The Conan RPG is swords and sorcery fantasy--darker, gritier, and just different enough to attract everybody.





The next thing I did was spend a long time with the rules myself. I read the rules closely, and tried to understand as much as I could. These are big, complicated rule sets, these d20 games, so I'm still looking at some concepts in the game. But I didn't involve the players until I felt I had a pretty good grasp on the rules myself.





Next, I decided that every Player Character would be of the same class. In the Conan that that's easy to do. It's much easier to believe a clan of Cimmerian Barbarians than it is an exclectic, D&D-ish group composed of a lot of different classes, with races from all over the world.

Picking the one race and the one character class narrowed down the scope of our learning (besides making a lot sense story-wise).

If you're playing a D&D game, try limiting the classes. You could set your game centered around a Thieves Guild and just allow Fighter and Thief characters. Or, you could set it around a church, and just allow Fighters and Clerics. Or, maybe there's a mage (NPC) who hires some help.

Limiting the classes really take a load off your plate when you're learning a new game. As long as it makes sense story-wise, you'll probably be glad you did it.





The next thing I did was go about creating a home for the PCs, the root of my sandbox. I created a village, some major NPCs, the PC's family, and some story threads that I could devlop later.

If you want to check out some of the stuff I'm talking about here, click on this link: CIMMERIAN BLOOD





Now, this part is the major answer to your question: Once I was ready to play our first session, I didn't start with the players having full characters. If you look at my outline for our first game sessions, you'll see that we didn't cover all the aspects of character generation.

FIRST GAME SESSION OUTLINE

I had the characters roll stats and decide on a SOME skills. That's it. I didn't go further with character generation.

If you look at one of those links above, you'll find mention of the Ras Croi. The inspiration for this race was really just to give the players something to do in order to learn how to use the skill system.

I designed a race, with skill checks for running, jumping, climbing, throwing, and swimming--all the physical skills.

Here's the post that describes the race: RAS CROI

And, as you will see, I worked it into the story.

The characters learned the game by playing through the story.

During game sesson two, we completed character creation.

GAME SESSION II OUTLINE

So, over two game sessions, the characters were created.





This is how I did it. Different folks have different tastes. But, the two game sessions when a long way towards the players getting the players to learn what the needed in order to play the game.

Hope that helps.





The next game sesssion
 

Water Bob said:
First off, let me say that you're in a prime position as DM if your players don't know the rules. Let your players focus on the story and look to you for help on rules.

You ask them what they want to do, while you're playing, and they tell you. Then, you simply tell them what to roll.

For many DM's, this is a dream situation.

This is really going to depend on system. In a system where the PC's have very few mechanically supported options, it's perfectly fine for the DM to handle all the mechanics. In a system where each PC has several idiosyncratic options specific to that character? Not so much.

Or, put it another way - quick, without looking it up, tell me how much damage a summoned dire badger does when it's been animal growth'ed.

Relying on one person to handle all the mechanics can drag the game pace into the basement in a real hurry.
 

This is really going to depend on system. In a system where the PC's have very few mechanically supported options, it's perfectly fine for the DM to handle all the mechanics. In a system where each PC has several idiosyncratic options specific to that character? Not so much.

Or, put it another way - quick, without looking it up, tell me how much damage a summoned dire badger does when it's been animal growth'ed.

Relying on one person to handle all the mechanics can drag the game pace into the basement in a real hurry.

I believe I said the same in the very next paragraph below the one you quoted.
 

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