Q: Templates, ECL, and HD

[Leopold]

Now let me ask y'all this, Let's say a PC takes a template after he already has some levels (becomes a shade perse). Do they gain the feats and so forth as if they had advanced that level (every 3rd level for a feat and 4th for a ability) or do ONLY advance if they take CHARACTER levels.

Ex: 10th lvl pc, takes a +3 template. he's now considered a CR of 13. Does he gain the above or only when his PC levels turn 13?

Also are templates that bmp your HD retroactive or only moving forward? I know CON is retroactive but is the HD bump also?

 

[Kae'Yoss]

He wouldn't get any new feats. It's like other races with an ECL-mod I think: for example, if you have 6th-level chars, a 6th-level elven sorcerer will have his three feats (1st, 3rd, 6th), but that drow rogue 4 only two (1st, 3rd). Only character level counts, not ECL adjustments for stronger races and the like. Though he would get starting gold like a 6th-level char (and AFAIK would be able to get epic feats as soon as 19th level, since his ecl is 21 then!)

The HD-bumps only affect creature HD I think, no class HD.

 

[Leopold]

Does monster HD increase with templates as well as class HD?

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Only the Monster HD you already have get the boost-up mentioned in the template. There won't be any additional HD, and Class HD stay the same.

So your Half-Dragon Elf Wizard 10 will still have his 10d4, but a Half-Dragon Minotaur Wizard 10 (unlikely as it is) will have 6d10 (formerly 6d8) plus 10d4. A Half-Dragon Minotaur without class levels will have 6d10.

 

[Tamarack]

I'm sorry, I must be lost I thought I was in the D&D rules section, not house rules, but so far I've seen two posts that say there are no official rules on adding ECL's (esp. after character creation) yet then go on to say that HD changes only affect monster HD not class HD. Let's go to the video tape...er, SRD. DMG pages 57-58, NPC Adjustments, under Half-Dragon.
"Hit Die increases one type to max of d12 (for all but the barbarian, add +1hp/level +1 additional hit point)."
Since the barbarian is a class, "...all but the barbarian" would seem to be talking about other classes, wizards, sorcerers, etc. I know this is NPC not PC, but it's the only RULE I could find.

 

[Leopold]

anyone know if this is true or not then? heck it's in the big rule book of them all...

 

[Knight Otu]

anyone know if this is true or not then? heck it's in the big rule book of them all...

The increase of just natural hit dice is not an official rule, it is at best an "officially encouraged" house rule. I don't remember where I saw it, sadly. Maybe Savage Species also talks about it, and I am sure that R3E will clarify this.

 

[Knight Otu]

double post

 

[Kae'Yoss]

anyone know if this is true or not then? heck it's in the big rule book of them all...

Hmm... undead indeed seem to get the full d12 for everything, some passages in the MM and MM2 do just that:

- The Death Knight (MM2 Template) says that all the characters HD (current and future) change to d12, and the sample, a ftr7/blk3 has 10d12.

- The Sample ghost (MM, HD change to d12) is a ftr5 with 5d12.

On the other hand, City of the Spider Queen has a half-drow/half-deep dragon as random encounter, he's Ftr3/Sor9 and has 3d10+6 plus 9d4+18.

Now, either CotSC is wrong with that, or half-dragons don't get better class HD. And it does make sense: monster HD come from your physical nature, while class HD come from your training (a human wizard only gets d4, but a human fighter gets d10. They are from the same race, but get different HD.). Also, the Dragon Disciple PrC increases the HD, but of the PrC only, and only future ones (not past ones), and it ends in becoming a half-dragon.