Question for the grognards: Why does D&D have dwarves/elves/hobbits etc.?

[kenobi65]

So, in short, "marketing gimmick" pretty much covers it.

But, at that time, was Gary really "marketing" D&D? The game was selling by word of mouth. I have a feeling he added them because the players wanted them.

 

[PapersAndPaychecks]

The telltale sign here is that Gary Gygax used Tolkein's made up words "dwarves" and "dwarven" (where correct English is "dwarfs" and "dwarfish") and, come to that, Tolkein's "elven" (where correct English is "elfin").

In other words, they're directly lifted from Tolkein, wholesale, lock, stock and barrel. And yeah, I've heard Gary deny it too, but that's obviously what he did.

 

[Celebrim]

They're in there because the players demanded it. I'm not sure you can blame Gygax so much, and in the 1st edition DMG he kinda makes like the races were included over his objections. Once they were 'in' they were the sort of thing that would be very hard to take away. Although I think EGG a bit disengenious for suggesting the game wasn't influenced heavily by Tolkien, I think he's being honest in saying that that wasn't the direction he wanted to take the game and the desires of the rest of the player base more or less forced his hand. EGG is simply wierd opinionated and eclectic enough for that to be true, and I can see JRRT (another wierd opionated and eclectic fellow) be not much of a fan of EGG's works either.

As for elves, Dunsany is clearly one of Tolkien's influences on the interpretation of elves. But I doubt that you'd get to D&D elves directly from Dunsany without the influence of Tolkien. And the presence of halflings too is a dead give away.

I'd be interested to hear where orcs and half-orcs and half-elves came from from those that are claiming something other than Tolkien as a primary influence.

 

[Mean Eyed Cat]

A secondary question would be where the !@#$% gnomes came from. Not like the game needs THREE little people races...

I believe gnomes came from Paracelsus [16th century alchemist, physician, and astrologer] who used the word in a treatise [as gnomi] to refer to elemental earth beings. It is possible he got the word from earlier folklore -- possibly from the greek "genomos" or "earth-dweller."

Why they were included in D&D [as they were similar to dwarves in mythology], I don't know. My guess is it might have to do with giving players more options when chosing a race.

 

[Celebrim]

The telltale sign here is that Gary Gygax used Tolkein's made up words "dwarves" and "dwarven" (where correct English is "dwarfs" and "dwarfish") and, come to that, Tolkein's "elven" (where correct English is "elfin").

In other words, they're directly lifted from Tolkein, wholesale, lock, stock and barrel. And yeah, I've heard Gary deny it too, but that's obviously what he did.

Yes, I agree. Although, a fairly good defense against that point is that the JRRT usage changed the English language, to the point that even people who aren't directly familiar with the good professors works will write 'elven' instead of 'elfin'.

 

[Terath Ninir]

But, at that time, was Gary really "marketing" D&D? The game was selling by word of mouth. I have a feeling he added them because the players wanted them.

That is marketing on the personal scale. My players want to play ninjas, I make rules for them to play ninjas. Just like I'd put ninjas in a for-sale game if people wanted 'em, no matter how silly I think they are.

Mean Eyed Cat -- thanks for the info. When I was a little kid, I was familiar with the gnomes of that one really popular coffee table books, so D&D gnomes confused me. I'm still confused about why he'd add *them* as another race choice. Especially since I've only ever seen someone play a gnome when they say, "Well, I've done everything else; might as well play a gnome this time!"

 

[Melan]

Unfortunately, whatever Gary claims, Tolkien's influence on D&D was much stronger than initially suspected. Although it may have been an afterthought or a minor addition to draw in Tolkien fans, demihumans and the rest of the Tolkien legacy quickly became a core of the game, especially once people were drawn to the implicite promise of "just like Tolkien, except YOU are the hero!" I wonder if the disenchantment so many people had experienced with the game might have been caused in part by expecting heroic struggles against a dark lord and instead getting Vancian magic, 10 foot corridors and gelatinous cubes. Food for thought.

 

[dcas]

The telltale sign here is that Gary Gygax used Tolkein's made up words "dwarves" and "dwarven" (where correct English is "dwarfs" and "dwarfish") and, come to that, Tolkein's "elven" (where correct English is "elfin").

Not to mention EGG's insistence that female dwarves have beards.

 

[Mark CMG]

For those interested, The Book of Wonder by Lord Dunsany is available as a free download from Creative Mountain Games.

 

[mmadsen]

There's a book list at the end of the 1E DMG where Gygax touts (some of) those that influenced D&D for him, though he has often downplayed Tolkein's influence since then and it must be mentioned that Arneson and a good number of others had more than a little input, so their own influences may vary from those of Poppa G.

That would be Appendix N: Inspirational and Educational Reading.