BluejayJunior
Explorer
I would have ruled the same as your DM. You cannot move through an enemy creature's space and the yellow line would take you through the enemy.
D&D 5E Question on diagonal movement with minatures (or VTT)
There is a simple reasonable point here that helps the argument- the creature is not a "terrain feature".
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
So, you are basically thinking (if I understand the logic) that something like this is going on:
Where the red lines represent the moving of the blue knight's space as it "slides" six squares. And since that path slides into a square occupied by the minotaur (red triangle), the blue knight can't move through it?
Yes, but that has nothing to do with the OP's question. OP is not asking about moving through the minotaur's reach (which is what matters for OAs), but moving through the minotaur's actual space (which is not allowed; you cannot move through an enemy's space, and Disengage doesn't change that). OP wants to know if the yellow path counts as moving through the minotaur's space.
I actually agree with this as far as RAW. The knight is not a dimensionless point; he himself takes up space and traces a path with a nonzero width. That path cannot intersect the space controlled by an enemy. No, the minotaur does not physically fill a 10x10 cube, but it does control that space and thus blocks movement through it.
That said, I'm not sure I feel like RAW handles this situation ideally. If it became an issue, I'd probably put the question to a vote at the table (but remind the players that whatever the outcome of that vote may be, it goes both ways--if PCs get to clip the corners of monsters, monsters get to clip the corners of PCs).
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
I guess we see RAW differently then. A character's space is measured from the center when it comes to movement. So, if you draw a line between the origin's center and the destination's center, and that line passes through any edge of a creature, you are passing through it's space. Otherwise, you aren't and can move by it.
If you look at the OP's diagram, the yellow line is the line from center to center, and doesn't pass through the edge of any space occupied by the minotaur.
But, as you say, as I've said, as others have said: as long as there are consistent rules agreed upon at the table, it really isn't a big deal. In a later post the OP specified how this was an important moment, him reaching that square was vital for whatever reason. Well, not knowing the rest of what was going on, but a move and dash would have gotten him there easily, without going near the minotaur...
Citation? I don't find this anywhere, and it conflicts with the rules on squeezing, which make it clear that you do in fact need a clear path of a certain width. Merely being able to draw a line between two points is not good enough--you can't pass through a 1-inch gap by lining yourself up just so.
Likewise, RAW is quite clear that you cannot "clip corners" of obstacles that fill their space. This does not map exactly onto the OP's situation (since the minotaur does not literally fill its space), but it's logical to infer that corner-clipping is forbidden by anything that prevents you entering the space, which the minotaur does.
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
For clarification of flanking, the lines are drawn from the center of the spaces, so I am using this as precedence. Because the center is the assumed space the creature fills when occupying a space, when they move I have them move from "center" to "center". Now, asking for citation is a bit weak IMO because there are a LOT of things in 5E where there are not concrete rules for citing. That is why I began my last post with "I guess we see RAW differently then."
A clear path of certain width for squeezing is about terrain, not creatures, such as moving through a smaller crawl space, etc. So, there is no conflict again because creatures do not "fill" their space, as you know. Your logic that the corner-clipping for creatures is fine (for you), but mine is that the minotaur stands in the "center" again, so there is room to maneuver past him. The corner-clipping thing is also because the terrain feature is immobile, you would literally be running into it, since it must "fill its space". Creatures (generally) don't fill their space (again, you know this), which is why you can move through a non-hostile creature's space. If creatures (including non-hostile) filled their spaces, you could never move through them (unless you employ the variant rules for Overrun, Shove Aside, or Tumble)
And, after all, the rule is only about moving through a creature's space, not around it. The two spaces (the 5ft and 15ft squares) are NOT occupied by the minotaur, so you can move through them on the diagonal. That is RAW since you can freely move into an adjacent space if you have at least one space of movement left, even if it is diagonally adjacent. You are only prevented from entering a hostile creature's space (to move through it) if they occupy that space.
tommybahama
Adventurer
OP here, the figure I made was simplified to the important details since I can't recreate the situation exactly from memory. There were other creatures chasing our blue knight.
Our DM rules that it takes double the movement to move through an ally's space (I think that's homebrew). I had him clarify that moving around a medium ally in combat in a complete circle would take 40 feet of movement which is at least consistent with his rules for moving around enemies. That seems excessive and very limiting given the nature of D&D maps and having a dozen or more creatures in the same area but what can you do.
Our DM rules that it takes double the movement to move through an ally's space (I think that's homebrew). I had him clarify that moving around a medium ally in combat in a complete circle would take 40 feet of movement which is at least consistent with his rules for moving around enemies. That seems excessive and very limiting given the nature of D&D maps and having a dozen or more creatures in the same area but what can you do.
Ovinomancer
No flips for you!
It's not homebrew. Moving through a creatures space is always double movement. You cannot move through an enemies space at all, unless it's 2 sizes larger or smaller than you, but then it's still difficult terrain. An ally can allow you to move through their space, but it's still difficult terrain.
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
Well a lot of other things do depend on the actually VTT at the time.
No, the actual rule is another creature's space (whether hostile or not) does count as difficult terrain. Normally, that means double move, but things like mobility and other class features ignore difficult terrain, so movement then would be normal.
If your DM says it is just "double movement" and not difficult terrain (since there is a difference), then that is a house-rule.
I should have mentioned that in my post above when I drew mocked-up diagrams.
EDIT: sniped by @Ovinomancer by seconds! That is what I get for changing the channel on the TV before hitting the post button!
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