Questions about OGL...

[Ranger REG]

They may also be referenced by "Core Rulebook" I - III. Inside the OGL there is a list of acceptable references for the core books.

Btw, is the Core being expanded with teh PsiHB, ELH, or MMII?

CORRECTION:

Inside the d20 System Trademark Usage Guide, there is a list of acceptable references and citations for the core books.

In fact, the new version of the Guide (v2.0) allows referencing of the Psionic's Handbook.

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While this mainly promotes Wizards' Dungeons & Dragons Third Edition Player's Handbook, publisher can promote other Wizards' core rulebook product, although not by title. Wizards cannot grant the use of someone else's trademarks such as Call of Cthulhu, Star Wars, and Wheel of Time to the public, even if it is part of the title of their core rulebook.

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I suspect that when d20 Modern Core Rulebook is released in November of this year 2002, referencing this new product will be added to the Guide, in addition to the d20 Modern Open Game Content to the System Reference Document.

 

[Celtavian]

Re

Thank you for all the information. Very helpful all of it. I am quite surprised that WOTC is releasing the core d20 game system for use by others royalty free.

It seems like a marketing move straight out of Microsoft's book. Very smart marketing.

 

[Byrons_Ghost]

I'm a bit confused on a couple of points....

First off, with things like monsters and psionics. I know that they've been somehow released in the SRD, but I haven't seen any references to this in the online SRD at wizards.com/d20, or anywhere else in those pages. I had thought we could only use those things that were posted, but obviously people have been using spells & monsters for some time now. So is there some sort of master list of what is and is not SRD open content? Or is the online one supposed to be that list, and everything else just exists under a sort of "gentlemen's agreement"?

Secondly, on the OGL vs. the d20 trademark- what exactly are the differences? The way I've read the FAQs and other info on the site, it seems that the d20 trademark thing is meant to designate products fully compatible with D&D, as opposed to something like Spycraft which really wouldn't be (I have no idea which version it uses). Or, is the OGL the "generic" version that the Foundation came up with (similar to a standardized open source license), and then d20 is WotC's version of it?

Any help here would be appreciated....

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

So is there some sort of master list of what is and is not SRD open content? Or is the online one supposed to be that list, and everything else just exists under a sort of "gentlemen's agreement"?

That's exactly right. Anything not yet released to the SRD is being used under a gentleman's agreement established back when Ryan Dancey was in charge of the OGL.

Secondly, on the OGL vs. the d20 trademark- what exactly are the differences?

The d20 logo is a trademark of Wizards of the Coast. It designates compatibility with the d20 system (not with D&D, though the use of the logo requires the product to also carry a message to the effect that the end user must use the Players Handbook).

The advantage to using the d20 STL is that you can put the d20 logo on the cover of your product as a marketing tool. Whether or not the d20 logo has any marketing value yet to the average RPG customer is a point for debate. I think it does; it certainly makes a difference to the retailers, I think, and it would take a well established company (or a well established licensed property) to successfully release an OGC product that did not include the d20 logo.

Wulf


EDIT: Just cleaned up my terminology a bit.

 

[jmucchiello]

First off, with things like monsters and psionics. I know that they've been somehow released in the SRD, but I haven't seen any references to this in the online SRD at wizards.com/d20, or anywhere else in those pages. I had thought we could only use those things that were posted, but obviously people have been using spells & monsters for some time now. So is there some sort of master list of what is and is not SRD open content? Or is the online one supposed to be that list, and everything else just exists under a sort of "gentlemen's agreement"?

That agreement only covers "everything else" located at http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd

Wulf did not mean everything else when he agreed with you.

 

[Lizard]

I'm a bit confused on a couple of points....



Secondly, on the OGL vs. the d20 trademark- what exactly are the differences? The way I've read the FAQs and other info on the site, it seems that the d20 trademark thing is meant to designate products fully compatible with D&D, as opposed to something like Spycraft which really wouldn't be (I have no idea which version it uses). Or, is the OGL the "generic" version that the Foundation came up with (similar to a standardized open source license), and then d20 is WotC's version of it?

Any help here would be appreciated....

The Open Gaming License is a CONTENT licence.
The D20 Trademark license is a TRADEMARK license.

All rules content is governed by the OGL. The D20 SRD at the OGF site was created by WOTC; the OGF is just hosting it. The OGF SRd, BTW, is 'unofficial'; it is being used under a 'gentleman's agreement' while the real SRD is being fully developed. (That's the one at the Wizard's site.) The catch is, if the non-official material changes prior to release, all publishers must change their works to comply prior to their next publication. (Once material has been officially released as Open Gaming Content, it's open forever, and such stipulations cannot apply. The 'gentleman's agreement' allows publishers to use material which is NOT Open as if it were, subject to the above caveat.)

Nothing NOT in the SRD is Open Content, period. If it isn't in the SRD, it isn't free for you to use. (Unless, of course, it's been designated as open content by another publisher using the OGL!) Anything which is open content can be used freely -- copy it, change it, print it out and sell it -- provided you obey the terms of the OGL when you do so.

The D20 license applies only to the right to use the D20 logo on the book. It has little to do with compatibility per se -- you agree not to redefine any 'defined terms' (these terms, and their definitions, are listed in the D20 Trademakr Guide), but you can create new terms. (i.e, you can't redefine 'Armor Class', but, you can ignore 'Armor Class' completley and use a 'Defense Factor' instead -- Defense Factor is NOT a defined term). Most importantly, though, you cannot include rules for creating a character or 'describing the effects of experience'. Again, see the D20 trademark guide for exactly what that means.

 

[Byrons_Ghost]

Ah, I think I'm getting this now. I'd forgotten that the OGF maintained a seperate document from the "official" one at the Wotc site.

Thanks for the info everyone.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Nothing NOT in the SRD is Open Content, period. If it isn't in the SRD, it isn't free for you to use. (Unless, of course, it's been designated as open content by another publisher using the OGL!)

Or from Wizards, as in the case of two monsters in the MM2.

*****

You may reference the Player's Handbook, PH, PHB, DMG, MM, Psionics Handbook, Core Rulebook I, Core Rulebook II, and Core Rulebook III. You may reference by page number, too, if you're not using the d20 STL (though I wouldn't suggest it).

Anything that is derivative of the SRD has to be OGC.

Unless, of course, you're under special license - Kingdoms of Kalamar, for example.

 

[Flynn]

Another OGL Question

I have a question regarding the Open Gaming License (OGL). As it deals with copyright and the OGL, I realize that some may feel that this is a touchy subject. If so, I apologize, but I only ask for the sake of curiosity, not in any sense of ill will.

As we all know, there's a lot of non-Open Game Content (OGC) to be found in the various WOTC sourcebooks, and people are frequently getting into trouble over using this content without Wizards' permission. I know, from reading several heated discussions on this and other lists, that WOTC cannot copyright game mechanics. I also have read that if a sufficient amount of the text is changed, the basic idea or concept behind a game mechanic can still be communicated without violating the copyright that Wizards has on the material. It would appear logical (doesn't mean it actually works this way, though) that a publisher could put together a quick PDF to post on their website that gives the basic feats, spells, classes, monsters, prestige classes, magic items, or what-have-you, from any on these non-OGC sourcebooks, with sufficient changes to avoid violating copyright while still preserving the mechanics, and then declare their content to be OGC, so that the sourcebook materials become available to all other publishers, using the OGC names and text, of course. For example, the feat Spellcasting Prodigy becomes the OGC feat Innate Spellcaster, with appropriate text that supports the same basic functionality, game mechanically.

While it would seem logical, it obviously doesn't work this way, or someone would have done so already. After all, having your company's name in section 15 of everyone else's OGL would have to be good advertising, at least on some level.

So here's the question: I know it doesn't work, but why? Is it legal? Or is it simply the spirit of cooperation that exists between D20 publishers and WOTC?

Just curious,
Flynn

 

[HellHound]

Also remember that just because it is OGC does NOT mean it can necessarily be used in a d20 product.

The d20 STL is a "safe harbor" for doing Dungeons & Dragons comapatable works. What you are talking is hauling anchor and leaving siad "safe harbor" to try to get around the legal aspects.

For example, the point-buy character creation system from D&D3e is NOT OGC, but a system IDENTICAL to it is available as OGC from the EverQuest RPG... but you couldn't use it in a d20 product.