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Questions about vampire 5th ed rules

OniDaimyo

Villager
I was watching the LA By Night stream, ran by Jason Carl and I have a few questions. Can vampires no longer soak damage? Non-lethal and lethal can be soaked by vampires...only agg cannot unless you have fortitude? Jasper should of been able to soak up that superficial damage he took in Ep 1 and 2 quite easily. Jason also had those rats be able to see Jasper even though he was obfuscated? Doesn't Obfuscate affect the mind? Thus the rats would NOT have been able to sense him and I know Obfuscate affects smell as well, unless things have been changed since v20 and earlier?

Does every dang power cost blood now? That's rather lame if it does. Are there optional rules suggested to change some things like that?

Thin bloods as a clan is lame. Can they go back to being able to be of any clan?
 

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5ekyu

Hero
66 views and not one person has any answers?

For my view it was the nature of the questions - combo of how stream does it and also references to first and previous eds that made it a bit more of a task than just questions about 5th ed would.

In general, i find direct questions about how an edition does something are more often going to get answers.

I was watching the LA By Night stream, ran by Jason Carl and I have a few questions. Can vampires no longer soak damage? Non-lethal and lethal can be soaked by vampires...only agg cannot unless you have fortitude? Jasper should of been able to soak up that superficial damage he took in Ep 1 and 2 quite easily. Jason also had those rats be able to see Jasper even though he was obfuscated? Doesn't Obfuscate affect the mind? Thus the rats would NOT have been able to sense him and I know Obfuscate affects smell as well, unless things have been changed since v20 and earlier?

Does every dang power cost blood now? That's rather lame if it does. Are there optional rules suggested to change some things like that?

Thin bloods as a clan is lame. Can they go back to being able to be of any clan?

"Soak" - Superficial damage such as normal guns vs vamps or fist vs humans is reduced automatically when applied - so no roll is required - its a % - so on the stream you would not "see it" but it was there. The Fortitude discipline has options a vamp can choose to change that even more. "Rouse Checks" that risk hunger can repair superficial damage.

"Cost blood" - The 5th ed does not track blood levels like previous ed did but instead ties it all into hunger stat. A few low tier abilities do not require "rouse checks" but most do. A "rouse check" can give you more hunger.

Every time you make a roll, some of your dice are hunger dice and what they roll can have pretty dramatic impact - as you might expect.

not gonna dive into the various discipline vs discipline and obfuscate rules.
 

OniDaimyo

Villager
It was reduced in v20 as well but that's for being a vampire, THEN you still had your stamina roll. Lethal damage isn't automatically reduced. Its soaked with stamina. But in V20 if you punched a vampire the damage is halfed and then soaked. It is not simply just halved, so maybe you are thinking incorrectly?

I did not ask how the stream was being done, I was asking about the rules because at times it seemed Jason was getting them wrong?

If they don't track blood levels then what is the point of being a elder? One of the advantages of better generation is higher blood pool. How do hunger checks work for vampires of a lower generation then?

And I do think he did Obfuscate wrong unless 5th ed changed it and made it weaker. Which is rather lame imo. Obfuscate doesn't affect your physical eyes, it affects the mind so a person walking around with unseen presence is actually avoided unless its really impossible to do so. If someone obfuscated were standing in front of you and you threw a punch, you'd actually subconciously throw it past them or over them. Its not mere D&D invisibility, unless once again, 5th ed changed how it works?
 

Dessert Nomad

Adventurer
For my view it was the nature of the questions - combo of how stream does it and also references to first and previous eds that made it a bit more of a task than just questions about 5th ed would.

For my view, I thought this was a thread about Vampires in 5th edition D&D because I forgot I was on the general RPG forum. Since I haven't played Vampire since 1e, I'm not really likely to contribute much. But since the OP complained that people were viewing but not commenting, I'll take that as soliciting useless but amusing comments like this.
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
66 views and not one person has any answers?

This site, like many, gets visited and read by many thousands of people who merely read and don't create an account or post. 66 visitors popping in to look at a thread isn't unusual.
 

Darth Palpy

Explorer
It's tied to blood potency and generation. With a sufficiently high blood potency (I don't remember right now the number exactly), your disciplines rouse check (for example can be re-rolled, a blood potency 3 giving you the possibility to reroll rouse check up to the second level of discipline, blood potency 5 up to the third level, etc...
Also, there is now only two type of damage, superficial & aggravated. For a vampire, physical superficial damage is automatically divided by 2. To substract damage, the only way is fortitude, at least at 2, which give you the capacity to substract a number of superficial damages equal to your Fortitude rating.
 


OniDaimyo

Villager
It's tied to blood potency and generation. With a sufficiently high blood potency (I don't remember right now the number exactly), your disciplines rouse check (for example can be re-rolled, a blood potency 3 giving you the possibility to reroll rouse check up to the second level of discipline, blood potency 5 up to the third level, etc...
Also, there is now only two type of damage, superficial & aggravated. For a vampire, physical superficial damage is automatically divided by 2. To substract damage, the only way is fortitude, at least at 2, which give you the capacity to substract a number of superficial damages equal to your Fortitude rating.

So fortitude no longer helps soak aggravated damage?
 

5ekyu

Hero
So fortitude no longer helps soak aggravated damage?

Ok so first on this...

"I did not ask how the stream was being done, I was asking about the rules because at times it seemed Jason was getting them wrong? "

"And I do think he did Obfuscate wrong unless 5th ed changed it..."

just like at many tables, GMs are free to run rules and interactions during streams as they see fit without being "wrong". many of the more popular streams make rulings, use house rules and a wide variety of options that may not be strictly RAW.

That is why i mentioned the bit about questioning how the stream was being run - as that stream like most VtM games i have seen played worry a lot more about scene than hard core RAW adherence.

I would myself be extremely hesitant to describe someone else as doing "it wrong" unless i had the rules and some experience with them.

But, as for your ongoing series of questions - in 5th the various disciplines give choices, not locked in powers per dot - and so fortitude may help with damage or may not.

Additionally there are quite a bit of differences between disciplines under normal use vs humans and cases where they interact with vampires and their interaction with other powers - far too numerous to expose here in any adequate detail.

The difference in blood potency are handled differently in 5th but many of the same kind of effects and results are there - just by different mechanics - again too numerous to go into detail.
 

just like at many tables, GMs are free to run rules and interactions during streams as they see fit without being "wrong". many of the more popular streams make rulings, use house rules and a wide variety of options that may not be strictly RAW.

That is why i mentioned the bit about questioning how the stream was being run - as that stream like most VtM games i have seen played worry a lot more about scene than hard core RAW adherence.

I would myself be extremely hesitant to describe someone else as doing "it wrong" unless i had the rules and some experience with them.

When a game is brand new, this is something I have a serious problem with. I want to see the rules run the way they are written to be run when it is a new game, or a new edition of a game, that I have never played before. I do not need to see a bunch of ad-libbing and freestyling of the rules, just to buy the core rules and find out that is not at all how they are written. Once the game is older and better known, then fine, houserule and ad-lib away because by then there will be enough info on the game out there to see if what you watched is actually how the rules are meant to work.
 

OniDaimyo

Villager
When a game is brand new, this is something I have a serious problem with. I want to see the rules run the way they are written to be run when it is a new game, or a new edition of a game, that I have never played before. I do not need to see a bunch of ad-libbing and freestyling of the rules, just to buy the core rules and find out that is not at all how they are written. Once the game is older and better known, then fine, houserule and ad-lib away because by then there will be enough info on the game out there to see if what you watched is actually how the rules are meant to work.

This guy gets it. I think Jason did things wrong. If he's house ruling it, it SHOULD be mentioned. Seriously, he got some things wrong and I think he has people roll rouse checks way too often for things that are actually free. For instance, the rats could NOT have found Jasper. Obfuscate does affect smell. Jasper could hide his scent, plus vampires don't sweat or have body oils so unless his clothes stink (Which they probably do) he wouldn't really have much scent? But Obfuscate still affects smell I think?
 

5ekyu

Hero
When a game is brand new, this is something I have a serious problem with. I want to see the rules run the way they are written to be run when it is a new game, or a new edition of a game, that I have never played before. I do not need to see a bunch of ad-libbing and freestyling of the rules, just to buy the core rules and find out that is not at all how they are written. Once the game is older and better known, then fine, houserule and ad-lib away because by then there will be enough info on the game out there to see if what you watched is actually how the rules are meant to work.
It's great you feel that way and when you start you own RAW VtM stream of RAW 5th, please post it here for us to follow. I am sure it will be both entertaining and informative.

But having a "serious problem" with how others choose to run their games is... well...
 

5ekyu

Hero
This guy gets it. I think Jason did things wrong. If he's house ruling it, it SHOULD be mentioned. Seriously, he got some things wrong and I think he has people roll rouse checks way too often for things that are actually free. For instance, the rats could NOT have found Jasper. Obfuscate does affect smell. Jasper could hide his scent, plus vampires don't sweat or have body oils so unless his clothes stink (Which they probably do) he wouldn't really have much scent? But Obfuscate still affects smell I think?
You seem to be making a **lot** of assumptions about a campaign, setting and ruleset you apparently dont have access to info on.

I wish you luck with that.
 


But having a "serious problem" with how others choose to run their games is... well...

I have a serious problem with any DM/Gamemaster/Referee/whatever not announcing in advance what from the RAW is being modified by houserules or ignored before a gaming session or campaign starts. That is a major violation of the social contract that person has with the gaming group and any audience there may or may not be.

I certainly hope you do not throw in changes to the RAW after a game has started and without warning anyone that you are going to do it.
 

OniDaimyo

Villager
Have to agree. If you are running a game in a video like that and then not announcing house rules...that's just a bad move especially when the game is just barely out AND you work for White Wolf? Jason isn't just some gamer. He works for White Wolf, any changes to rules as written should be announced. I like the story and the acting but there's still some things that seem like screwups or forgetting certain things. Annabelle didn't frenzy once with meeting Carver? No check? Nothing? Given how she gave into anger and first attacked him on sight? I'd of made her check and given a big warning.
 

5ekyu

Hero
I have a serious problem with any DM/Gamemaster/Referee/whatever not announcing in advance what from the RAW is being modified by houserules or ignored before a gaming session or campaign starts. That is a major violation of the social contract that person has with the gaming group and any audience there may or may not be.

I certainly hope you do not throw in changes to the RAW after a game has started and without warning anyone that you are going to do it.
Since I am not in that campaign, they did not need to announce it to me or include me in their session zero and table rules - so I wont be getting upset over it.

If they got up with you and told you this would be strict RAW, I can understand you being upset, what with you being apparently a player.
 

5ekyu

Hero
I know enough and you are wrong about not having info on it. What was that about assuming?
All I have to go on regarding your level of info is what you have said here which tends to show knowledge of previous editions and not a lot of info about the current edition. If you have had do much info on this edition why ask do many questions as if you didn't? Seems odd.

For me, without access to Jaspers character sheet and his character traits, I am in no position to make judgements on how he smells. Apparently, you do?

That's great.
 

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