D&D 5E Questions from a Newb

[Greenfield]

We just started our first 5e adventure, with an eye towards turning it into a long term campaign. Most of the people in the group have played every edition since 1st, and are currently playing 3.5.

From what I'm reading, each class gets Proficiency with two ability scores. This means that any ability checks made against those abilities will add the character's level-based Proficiency bonus to the the roll.

All Skills are handled as Ability Checks, from what I'm seeing. Each character will have a number of Skills they are proficient in, meaning again that they can add their Proficiency bonus to the rolls.

So the question is, do the Proficiency bonus points from a proficient ability score apply to all applicable skills?

That is, if Strength is a "Proficient Ability", does my Fighter get to add his proficiency points to all Strength based ability checks, including Skills?

If so, it seems that common wisdom in character design is kind of backwards in 5e. When selecting skills to be trained in (i.e. "proficient in") we should select skills that are based on the character's non-proficient ability scores.

Am I reading something wrong?

Also, from what I'm seeing, ability checks used as Saving Throws will only advance with level if they're in the class' "proficient abilities".

If so, this again suggests that conventional wisdom should be ignored: Put good numbers in the class' non-proficient ability scores, otherwise your character will have a "glass jaw" through all of their career for cerain Saves.

Again, using the Fighter as an example, if I create a fighter with a Wisdom of 10, he'll be at a +0 on all Wisdom Saves forever. 1st level, 10th level or 75th level, he'll be a sucker for a Hold Person.

Am I understanding this correctly?

 

[The Grassy Gnoll]

Hi

No, classes and backgrounds and/or race give you Proficiency in specific Skills. Skills are subdivided into Stats, but unless you have Proficiency in the specific skill, you can't add your Proficiency bonus. You can for example have a low Cha but Proficiency in Intimidate. Equally, a high Cha won't net you a level-scalable bonus in intimidation unless that specific skill has proficiency, leaving it a flat stat-based bonus regardless of level.

In terms of stats, if you feel your 'glass jaw' stat is letting you down, increase it when you can. Because yes, your 75th level Fighter with a Wis of 10 will be at risk from Wis save spells. By that time, though, even in a low-magic setting, he will have picked up a trinket or two to help with stuff like that.

You can also spend downtime between adventures to learn new skills and become Proficient in them, too.

If min/maxing is your thing, Dex and Wis are king, regardless.

 

[dmnqwk]

In 3.5 you have reflex, willpower and fortitude. In 5th edition, you have Saving throws based on each ability instead - you are accidently reading "Each class is proficient in 2 saving throws" as "Each class is proficient in 2 ability scores." So basically a Fighter adds her proficiency bonus to any Strength or Constitution Saving Throw (not ability check).

There are ability checks based on actual abilities (just to confuse you further) but those are things like Initiative is now a Dexterity ability check (please note Rogues do NOT add their proficiency to this because they are only proficient in Dexterity SAVING THROWS, not ABILITY CHECKS. Consequently anything which adds bonuses to dexterity ability checks will add to initiative, like a Bard's Jack of All Trades ability).

So to clarify:
1) There are ability checks based on your abilities... but these are completely separate from saving throws, and outside of initiative not used too often because they're usually skill checks instead.
2) Each characters gets proficiency in 2 saving throws, not ability checks. You get 6 saving throws (one for each ability) in 5th, as opposed to having Reflex, Willpower and Fortitude.
3) Saving throws don't generally see the bonuses go quite so high. Assuming a stat of 20, the maximum without magic allowed now, then you're looking at +11 (since the highest the proficiency bonus goes being +6 at level 17). So assuming you're level 1 you might have saves of +5/+5/+2/+0/+0/-1. Think of it less as "glass jaw" and more "4 mediocre ones and 2 good ones."

If you become concerned, when you take an ASI (ability score increase, which is adding +2 or 2 lots of +1 to attributes, remembering the max allowed is 20 without powerful magics) then you are allowed to buy a feat instead, which includes the Resilient Feat. Resilience gives you +1 in an attribute and proficiency in that saving throw. So if you fancy, as a Fighter, being capable of resisting Wisdom Saving throws like hold person... this is the way to go!

 

[Shiroiken]

There are 3 types of checks: attacks, ability, and saves. Proficiency will give you a bonus on the relevant roll.

Weapon Proficiency gives you the bonus to attacks. In addition, if you are not proficient, you suffer Disadvantage in addition (which is a bit harsh IMO).

Save Proficiency normally come from your class (I believe that's what you called your "proficient ability). You will have 1 common Save (Con, Dex, or Wis) and 1 uncommon/rare Save (Str, Cha, or Int). There is only one way to get another Save proficiency, and that's the Resilient Feat. In general, the Saves DCs aren't very high (usually between 10-15), even at higher levels, so you still have a fair chance to succeed without the proficiency.

Skills and Tool proficiency are gained mostly from Backgrounds and possibly from your Class. They allow you to add to an ability check where they are relevant (pretty much the DMs discretion). Baring Expertise (which allows you to add your bonus twice), an unskilled character still has a fair chance to succeed without the proficiency without it being an auto-pass for someone skilled. You can gain new Tool proficiency (by spending 250 days and gp), but you can only gain new skills with the Skilled Feat.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

Weapon Proficiency gives you the bonus to attacks. In addition, if you are not proficient, you suffer Disadvantage in addition (which is a bit harsh IMO).

One correction--you do not suffer disadvantage for using a non-proficient (or even improvised) weapon. All you lose is the proficiency bonus.

 

[Cyan Wisp]

There is only one way to get another Save proficiency, and that's the Resilient Feat.

That, or being a 14th level monk where you gain proficiency in all saves.

 

[Illithidbix]

That, or being a 14th level monk where you gain proficiency in all saves.

And Rogues!

SLIPPERY MIND

By 15th level, you have acquired greater mental strength. You gain proficiency in Wisdom saving throws.

 

[Jester David]

From what I'm reading, each class gets Proficiency with two ability scores. This means that any ability checks made against those abilities will add the character's level-based Proficiency bonus to the the roll.

No, this is what you're reading wrong.
What you're referring to sounds like saves. Each class gets to add their proficiency bonus to their ability scores for two saving throws.

All Skills are handled as Ability Checks, from what I'm seeing. Each character will have a number of Skills they are proficient in, meaning again that they can add their Proficiency bonus to the rolls.

Yes.

Also, from what I'm seeing, ability checks used as Saving Throws will only advance with level if they're in the class' "proficient abilities".

If so, this again suggests that conventional wisdom should be ignored: Put good numbers in the class' non-proficient ability scores, otherwise your character will have a "glass jaw" through all of their career for cerain Saves.

Again, using the Fighter as an example, if I create a fighter with a Wisdom of 10, he'll be at a +0 on all Wisdom Saves forever. 1st level, 10th level or 75th level, he'll be a sucker for a Hold Person.

Am I understanding this correctly?

Pretty much.
5e is unforgiving with dump stats since any dump stat could require a saving throw. But it's really nice to have that one stat you're always going to succeed at, like a wizard with Intelligence.

But unlike other systems (3e, 4e) saving throw DCs don't go up that much. A CR 1/4 creature has a DC of 13 while a CR 15 creatures has DCs of 18. The fighter will always have a chance, and often be able to reroll each round. And allies can give advantage and such.

 

[Greenfield]

Okay.

Something else I'm picking up: You can gain proficiency in some specific "skills" (in the 3.* sense) by taking proficiency in the tools specific to that "skill".

For example, a character who doesn't have Sleight of Hand can still learn to be proficient at lock picking, by training a proficiency in the tool set "Thief's Tools". A character who doesn't have the Perform skill can still learn to perform with a specific musical instrument by training a proficiency in that particular instrument.

What said character shouldn't bother to do is start with those tool proficiencies if he/she is also taking the actual skill group that includes it.

Is this part right?

 

[Jester David]

Okay.

Something else I'm picking up: You can gain proficiency in some specific "skills" (in the 3.* sense) by taking proficiency in the tools specific to that "skill".

For example, a character who doesn't have Sleight of Hand can still learn to be proficient at lock picking, by training a proficiency in the tool set "Thief's Tools". A character who doesn't have the Perform skill can still learn to perform with a specific musical instrument by training a proficiency in that particular instrument.

What said character shouldn't bother to do is start with those tool proficiencies if he/she is also taking the actual skill group that includes it.

Is this part right?

Right. Kinda.

Picking a lock is a straight up Dexterity check. It doesn't use the Sleight of Hand skill, which is more picking pockets and hiding objects. Tools are different in that if you have the tool and know how to use them, you can add your proficiency bonus to the check. But it's different than a skill in that it's much more focused, slightly easier to learn, and you need the object in question.