And don't forget the rule #1 of racism. Don't pick on anyone stronger than you. No matter how big the differences are, overt racism is only displayed against someone who can't fight back.
Racism in RPGs, especially related to fantastic races
- Thread starter Lwaxy
- Start date
And don't forget the rule #1 of racism. Don't pick on anyone stronger than you. No matter how big the differences are, overt racism is only displayed against someone who can't fight back.
Storminator
First Post
My game is goblin PCs. It's full of casual racism. They constantly complain about poncy elves and soft humans. The warforged saying "worthless meatbags . . . present company excluded . . . " is practically a staple of game day. I had an NPC describe elf warriors as special unique snowflakes of death last session.
No important social commentary there, just goblins being goblins.
PS
No important social commentary there, just goblins being goblins.
PS
Storminator
First Post
I started my Goblins of Eberron campaign with a bunch of adventurers attacking the PC's goblin cave. The adventuring cleric specifically yelled something like this out during the attack: "The church teaches that goblins have no souls! We violate no laws of God nor man in slaying them!" just to, you know, get the PC persecution complex going . . .
PS
I suspect, that framed in the context of "the PCs are goblins and probably evil" lets the racism be "just a game"
As long as everybody's being racist to NPCs and knows they are just imaginary beings and not stand-ins for some real demographic.
Sounds fine to me. And since your next post has the goblin PCs as targets of racism, it sets the tone for "racism isn't nice to you." which should be enough to remind people what side of any social commentary could be going on.
Posr
First Post
Good point. I think that the issue of racism in fantasy settings often has its roots in the moral absolutism inherent in the use of alignment as a game mechanic. Moral opposites are expected to kill each other with impunity. Obviously YMMV, but that is what I see as the foundation for the pernicious idea that moral characteristics are inherent in races.
Sword of Spirit
Legend
One of the things that is occured to me is that people don't use the word "racism" the same way.
Racial prejudice is almost ubiquitous in history. It just means that: pre-judging someone based on their race/culture (same thing), often in a negative light. The idea of not being racially prejudiced (while I agree with it) is an extremely modern idea, and a heck of a lot easier said than actually done.
Racism, as it has been explained to me, is more than prejudice, it is prejudice + power. Much uglier, and still unfortunately all too common in history.
Racial hatred, or hating someone because of their race, can exist with or without racism (though, of course, it would be odd to have it without prejudice). Racial hatred, I tend to imagine is rarer than either of the others. Usually it will happen as the result of wars or violence, not the original causes. Unless there is serious conflict, most people aren't going to work up enough antipathy to truly hate someone because of their race.
So the French and the English are prejudiced against each other. South Africa or American slavery are go to examples of racism, and the conflicts in the Baltics likely create a lot of racial hatred. There are also a lot of individuals who are more or less in possession of these traits than their cultural in general.
So I wouldn't remove racial prejudice from my game if I wanted any degree of believability. My human might not bear any ill-will towards elves or seek to interfere in their lives, but he doesn't think they are nearly as dependable as humans. Dwarves are just too dour, etc.
Racism and racial hatred make appearances if appropriate to the story line, the world, or themes to be explored. I wouldn't expect a heroic character to be any more racist or have more racial hatred than his culture, unless he had a compeling reason. Maybe his parents were murdered by elven assassins.
An innkeeper hates orcs because they have raided his family's home and killed some of them. He is prejudiced against the goblins from the other side of town because of what he has heard about their culture. And he racistly excludes lizardfolk from his establishment because he doesn't like the type of manners and etiquette they tend to exhibit--though he doesn't feel any strong negativity towards them as people.
Racial prejudice is almost ubiquitous in history. It just means that: pre-judging someone based on their race/culture (same thing), often in a negative light. The idea of not being racially prejudiced (while I agree with it) is an extremely modern idea, and a heck of a lot easier said than actually done.
Racism, as it has been explained to me, is more than prejudice, it is prejudice + power. Much uglier, and still unfortunately all too common in history.
Racial hatred, or hating someone because of their race, can exist with or without racism (though, of course, it would be odd to have it without prejudice). Racial hatred, I tend to imagine is rarer than either of the others. Usually it will happen as the result of wars or violence, not the original causes. Unless there is serious conflict, most people aren't going to work up enough antipathy to truly hate someone because of their race.
So the French and the English are prejudiced against each other. South Africa or American slavery are go to examples of racism, and the conflicts in the Baltics likely create a lot of racial hatred. There are also a lot of individuals who are more or less in possession of these traits than their cultural in general.
So I wouldn't remove racial prejudice from my game if I wanted any degree of believability. My human might not bear any ill-will towards elves or seek to interfere in their lives, but he doesn't think they are nearly as dependable as humans. Dwarves are just too dour, etc.
Racism and racial hatred make appearances if appropriate to the story line, the world, or themes to be explored. I wouldn't expect a heroic character to be any more racist or have more racial hatred than his culture, unless he had a compeling reason. Maybe his parents were murdered by elven assassins.
An innkeeper hates orcs because they have raided his family's home and killed some of them. He is prejudiced against the goblins from the other side of town because of what he has heard about their culture. And he racistly excludes lizardfolk from his establishment because he doesn't like the type of manners and etiquette they tend to exhibit--though he doesn't feel any strong negativity towards them as people.
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My regular group is three black guys, two black girls, and me (filipino mestizo). According to what I've been told, there isn't really a precedent that any of them felt that made them feel like outsiders in the hobby-- although one of the girls felt that being a woman was a barrier. More often they complain about racism in the comic books community.
In game, I have an inclination towards not painting a species as evil. However, that's cause I usually run games that are more grey than black and white. I like the portrayal of dark elves in 13th Age, for example. However, I've ran games where orcs are shown being evil and whatnot. I don't see a problem with this. I feel something that needs to be stressed a lot of the time that just because it happens in a group, it doesn't necessarily mean the GM agrees with it. Just because orcs are wholly evil in a campaign doesn't mean that there's some subconscious need to portray races as evil by nature. And there isn't any reason to battle that in some settings. If you hate codified evil races, take it out of your game. Even easier to do if you homebrew instead of run something like the Realms or Greyhawk or something.
In game, I have an inclination towards not painting a species as evil. However, that's cause I usually run games that are more grey than black and white. I like the portrayal of dark elves in 13th Age, for example. However, I've ran games where orcs are shown being evil and whatnot. I don't see a problem with this. I feel something that needs to be stressed a lot of the time that just because it happens in a group, it doesn't necessarily mean the GM agrees with it. Just because orcs are wholly evil in a campaign doesn't mean that there's some subconscious need to portray races as evil by nature. And there isn't any reason to battle that in some settings. If you hate codified evil races, take it out of your game. Even easier to do if you homebrew instead of run something like the Realms or Greyhawk or something.
WayneLigon
Adventurer
It's much much older than that. Look at the list of books that inspire D&D and are the basis for almost all Western fantasy literature. Almost all of them have a component that, if looked at in a certain light, might could be constructed as 'fantasy racism' by a few. Conan has beastmen and lizardmen and various other types of ethnic human and inhuman foes that described in broad terms. And from Tolkien, with 'dark creatures' - orcs and goblins that are born evil, and the Men of the East, the 'wicked men' that have served the spirit of Sauron for thousands of years.
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