D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

[Enrahim]

OK?

Depending on further details, I'm not sure what is stopping you playing that character. Or maybe with those further details, it will turn out that the character is too passive to be a good fit for a MHRP or variant game.

So early Bruce Banner is out?

 

[pemerton]

The limitations of "Cunning" in the context of "like a D&D thief" was immediately obvious.

I posted the PC sheet upthread. Here it is again:

Even for someone not familiar with the details of the MHRP system, I would think that its fairly easy to work out what this PC is about!

 

[Maxperson]

Good thing there isn't, then. Glad I could help you out, since you seemed extremely confused.


Again, I have no idea what you're talking about. The limitations of "Cunning" in the context of "like a D&D thief" was immediately obvious. The fact you found some textual interpretation of the phrasing that says otherwise doesn't change the relationship between the GM and the player, which is all that matters.

He never said "like a D&D thief." You are twisting his statement. What he said was that cunning as he used it INCLUDED the D&D thief. "Included" doesn't mean "like." Batteries are included in some toys. That does not mean that batteries are the only thing in the toy box.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

And again, the fact that the mechanical resolution method takes player intent and character modifiers into account INSTEAD OF being a purely neutral encounter roll or GM decision DOES NOT impact actor stance.

The fact that the GM used your Diplomacy roll to decide that a high-level cleric was in the temple, rather than consulting their notes or making an extrapolation based on setting notes, does not matter unless you choose to be bothered by it.

I mean it matters once it is codified mechanic and the players know of it. Now generating high priests via diplomacy rolls becomes a valid tactic.

 

[pemerton]

So early Bruce Banner is out?

Because? I've only read a bit of the early Hulk comics, but neither Bruce Banner nor Hulk is particularly passive as a character. Both have pretty strong (though conflicting) drives.

 

[Maxperson]

Gygax explains it in his DMG, p 20:

This ability assumes that the longuage is, in fact, one which the thief has encountered sometime in the past. . . . Even if able to read a language, the thief should be allowed only to get about that percentage of the meaning of what is written as his or her percentage ability to read the tongue in the first place. The rest they will hove to guess at. Languages which are relatively close to those known by the thief will not incur such a penalty.​

Those cunning thieves - they pay attention to all the runes and sigils and scraps of this and that that they encounter on their travels . . .

That's another incorrect use of cunning. There's nothing deceptive about paying attention to runes and sigils, and nothing intuitive about paying attention to runes and sigils.

Those thieves are skillfully paying attention to runes and sigils and scraps of this and that for the purpose of being able to translate other things they encounter.

Gygax DID explain what he meant by cunning, but you are skillfully ignoring it so that you can continue to argue that what he meant by cunning something that he did not. I'll quote it again for you.

"Thieves are principally meant to take by cunning and stealth"

They use their cunning to take(by deception), though that's not the only thing they use to take. There is no other definition of how cunning is used given by Gygax.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Your second statement seems perfectly fine to me. You're laying out a possible fail state instead of a success state.

But, they are an expert, just a pessimistic one! So they say "This is an ancient dungeon, so it it likely that these runes are some sort of a curse. I have a look to be sure." And like @pemerton has explained, them being expert means that their conjectures have higher chance of being true, thus it cannot be a fail condition that the bad thing happens!

 

[TwoSix]

He never said "like a D&D thief." You are twisting his statement. What he said was that cunning as he used it INCLUDED the D&D thief. "Included" doesn't mean "like." Batteries are included in some toys. That does not mean that batteries are the only thing in the toy box.

That sort of "but actually" nonsense is the province of children and lawyers. No one here has to be Jeremy Crawford defending rules minutiae.

If a player tried to use that interpretation, the correct response is "Dude, you know that's not what it means."

 

[Maxperson]

How is the epistemic state in terms of the posibility regarding the posibility of the runes revealing something positive that isn't a map? How is the epistemic state in terms of the posibility that trying to read would yield absolutely no result beyond the character not being able to read them?

Good God, there has been too much Epstein in the news. I completely misread that word the first time.

 

[Enrahim]

Because? I've only read a bit of the early Hulk comics, but neither Bruce Banner nor Hulk is particularly passive as a character. Both have pretty strong (though conflicting) drives.

I already regret bringing up the topic on a forum like this, as I realise I am likely among those here knowing least about the topic. I had mainly in mind early "career" as potrayed in recent movies. That portrayed Bruce as relatively timid, going to some lenghts to prevent the hulk getting out, while still being characterised by an open mind and wish to help.

First marvel character that came to mind I thought might have approached the runes in somewhat similar manner as I described.