D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

[Micah Sweet]

Just have the table go the video game route. Resurrected players respawn somewhere else...somewhere far, far away from their gear.

Corpse run!

 

[Micah Sweet]

When I threw a pack of Rust Monsters at my group, they players reacted with much more (genuine) fear and trepidation than they had expressed for any number of MUCH more threatening encounters prior to that.

Players REALLY hate having their PCs gear threatened.

It's IMO an unfortunate attitude that has little to do with what most any character would actually do in the fiction.

 

[kermit4karate]

It's IMO an unfortunate attitude that has little to do with what most any character would actually do in the fiction.

Well said! In games it can take some "tuning" to make players feel death's consequences.

No, I don't mean physical torture.

Although...

 

[AlViking]

When I threw a pack of Rust Monsters at my group, they players reacted with much more (genuine) fear and trepidation than they had expressed for any number of MUCH more threatening encounters prior to that.

Players REALLY hate having their PCs gear threatened.

Part of the reason I've never used rust monsters is that it's already hard for fighter types to compete with wizards at high levels. Lose that sword, your armor and shield? That can hurt. The wizard losing his belt buckle? Not really much of an issue until his pants fall down. Meanwhile the monk makes fun of them both.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Part of the reason I've never used rust monsters is that it's already hard for fighter types to compete with wizards at high levels. Lose that sword, your armor and shield? That can hurt. The wizard losing his belt buckle? Not really much of an issue until his pants fall down. Meanwhile the monk makes fun of them both.

I don't spend a lot if time at high levels, and the games I play have IMO a better martial/caster balance than vanilla 5e (albeit in different ways).

 

[Remathilis]

It's IMO an unfortunate attitude that has little to do with what most any character would actually do in the fiction.

How so?

"This weapon is your life." isn't just a D&D sentiment. I would hate to lose my father's sword regardless of whether it was a regular longsword or Excalibur. People become attached to their stuff, be it the character OR the sword the character uses. Ditto for those sweet named items with history and lore that disappear because of a crappy gotcha trap like a rust monster.

And mind you, I'm not talking about items being lost or stolen where they are recoverable. I'm talking gone forever. I'm kinda happy D&D has gotten rid of item destruction for that reason.

And no: making death more permanent doesn't fix the problem. It just extends it from gear to "gear and the character you've played for months/years"

 

[Remathilis]

Part of the reason I've never used rust monsters is that it's already hard for fighter types to compete with wizards at high levels. Lose that sword, your armor and shield? That can hurt. The wizard losing his belt buckle? Not really much of an issue until his pants fall down. Meanwhile the monk makes fun of them both.

Wizards laugh until they encounter bookworms and watch their spellbook end up pulp. (Although, most of the time it was failed fireball saves or sudden dunks in water that caused spellbook ruination.)

 

[Micah Sweet]

How so?

"This weapon is your life." isn't just a D&D sentiment. I would hate to lose my father's sword regardless of whether it was a regular longsword or Excalibur. People become attached to their stuff, be it the character OR the sword the character uses. Ditto for those sweet named items with history and lore that disappear because of a crappy gotcha trap like a rust monster.

And mind you, I'm not talking about items being lost or stolen where they are recoverable. I'm talking gone forever. I'm kinda happy D&D has gotten rid of item destruction for that reason.

And no: making death more permanent doesn't fix the problem. It just extends it from gear to "gear and the character you've played for months/years"

I wouldn't want to lose my grandfather's sword either. But given the choice between that and death...well, I wouldn't choose death, and I wouldn't consider the threat of death less scary than the threat if losing a prized possession.

And your concern about tougher resurrection (not more permanent death as you suggest) exacerbates what I see as the problem with threatening PCs whose players are too attached IMO to them.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Wizards laugh until they encounter bookworms and watch their spellbook end up pulp. (Although, most of the time it was failed fireball saves or sudden dunks in water that caused spellbook ruination.)

Also a significant setback, but not worse than death.

 

[Alzrius]

Also a significant setback, but not worse than death.

Which is why traveling spellbooks, scrolls, and other backups have been a thing for a very, very long time.