Rapid Shot, Flurry of Blows -- _____ for melee?

[Phaedrus]

Is there a RAW feat that replicates Rapid Shot for melee weapons?

And if not, why not?
Any reason an extra attack with all attacks at -2 would be imbalancing as a melee feat?

 

[kyloss]

They do its called two weapon fighting, and if the had it more generic it would through off the balance with two handed weapons (even more). Although I'd be fine making it a simple style choice for two weapon fighting and add a flurry attack option, and leave the two weapon feats open for things like two weapon diffence. But that's just me, because we rarely have rogues with two weapons specialization who can get full round sneak attacks. Its not a problem when it happens, the rogues get a chance to shine. This is really fun when it's the enemies, all of a sudden thugs get scary again.

 

[Phaedrus]

I admit I hadn't thought about TWF.

I know bringing in common sense and realism are taboo, but I don't understand why it's acceptable (realistic) to get an arrow, nock, draw, and release an extra time in 6 seconds but you can't swing your sword one more time?

So we're saying that to preserve TWF's specialness we leave a melee version of Rapid Shot out?

 

[Hawken]

As far as mechanics go, it would totally disrupt the game. It's a great idea, but its just not too feasible. If you had that ability, let's call it Rapid Swing for this discussion, you would totally dominate melee combat. At low levels, it could help, but mid to high levels, you would have a walking blender on your hands.

A 6th level fighter with that feat (and no bonuses, yeah right!), would have attacks at +6 and +1. With Rapid Swing, he would get attacks at +4, +4 and -1.

If that same fighter had two weapon fighting (and a light, off-hand weapon), he would get attacks at +2, +2, +2, and -3. And if for some reason that extra swing applied to his off-hand attacks as well, that would be +2, +2, -3 for primary and +0, +0 for his off-hand attacks. Having a 6th level anything making 5 attacks is silly.

 

[Coredump]

I admit I hadn't thought about TWF.

I know bringing in common sense and realism are taboo, but I don't understand why it's acceptable (realistic) to get an arrow, nock, draw, and release an extra time in 6 seconds but you can't swing your sword one more time?

So we're saying that to preserve TWF's specialness we leave a melee version of Rapid Shot out?

Well, whether using a bow or a sword, 6 seconds is a *very* short time, so you have to be careful about 'realism'.

But to answer your question, the archer isn't also worried about the guy next to him trying to hit him back. If the swordsman was just swinging away, then no problem. But the whole ducking-and-weaving thing takes up some time also.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

To better answer Phaedrus' question, the DnD attack is a generalization of 'attacks that might actually deal damage' instead of 'swings of sword'.
It's not that the swordsman is swinging one more time, its that one more of the many times he swings, there is a chance of dealing damage.

With the archer, the generalization tends to hiccup as it is presumed each attack is one additional arrow downrange.. which stetches both the concept and suspension of disbelief. But this hiccup is mainly for tracking ammunition, which is important as the ammunition may be magical in nature.

Unfortunately it is easier as a DM to describe the sequence of by-play in the round with attack roll = swing, and most players learn this as the way it works without understanding the generalization.

Hope that helps some

As to the topic at hand, I think a 'Rapid Swing' would alter the balance of current melee feats too much. There is a fine line involved in the whole TWF/sword n board/2h fighting as evidenced by the recurrant 'XX fighting is overpowered!' threads

 

[Beholder Bob]

You mean... flurry of blows?

 

[Phaedrus]

I agree with you... it would be unbalancing.

And while I know it's not "just one more swing", I must admit I still fall back into that kind of thinking unless I make a conscious effort.

 

[ARandomGod]

Is there a RAW feat that replicates Rapid Shot for melee weapons?

And if not, why not?
Any reason an extra attack with all attacks at -2 would be imbalancing as a melee feat?

But two weapon fighting IS one extra attack with all attacks at -2... Of course, it's not as limited as rapid shot, which can only be taken with certain weapon types... (Well, I'm assuming you can't use it with extra large siege engine ranged weapons)

TWF allows you do this with even larger weapons than you would normally be able to wield in two hands! There is, of course, an additional penalty. But you wouln't need an extra feet for it.

 

[Felon]

Personally, I always wanted to see monks' flurry become a melee version of Manyshot. Monk actually gets to use his enhanced movement to run up to a foe, and BAM POW SOK.