Rasslin'- D&D Style!

[drdevoid]

What's the best idea for feats (from any supplements) for making a wrestler? Which feats are better? And which is the best class combo- Barbarian/Fighter, Fighter/Rogue, Barbarian/Rogue, straight Fighter (I don't know if I'd want to make a Monk into a wrestler)? For race I was thinking of Human or Half-Orc, really depends on the dice there.

Here's what I can think of for feats:

Improved Unarmed Strike
Power Attack
Improved Trip
Improved Bull Rush
Combat Reflexes
Clever Wrestling (MotW)
Fists of Iron (S&F)
Dirty Fighting (S&F)
Knock Down (S&F)
Prone Attack (S&F)- although to the prereq, Lightning Reflexes, I say, 'Yo Mama!'
Close Quarters Fighting (S&F)
Expert Tactician (S&F)
Power Lunge (S&F)
Reckless Offensive (Enemies & Allies)

Is it better (obviously cheesy) to take some Rogue levels just for the Tumble and Escape Artist ranks? Would making such a wrestler be a bad idea just because the game mechanics would be very slow and clunky? I'm playing some games just for fun and I think I'm going to get my Barbarian killed soon so I wanted to think up another fun kind of character.

Any and all help is appreciated,
Joe Sullivan

 

[Victim]

It takes alot of ranks in escape artist to make it comparable to a decent fighter's grapple check, so multiclassing to rogue isn't a good idea. Also, if possible, you want the character to provoke AoOs from movement so the enemy can't take one to respond to your grapple attack, so tumble might not be the best move either.

The Barbarian/Monk combo in Heroes of High Favor: half orcs is really good at grapple attacks.

 

[drdevoid]

I should also mention this would be a 6th or 7th level PC.

For purposes of showmanship and a more acrobatic style, I suppose I could play a "No holds Bard".

Ahem.

<Dr. Devoid crawls back to the dark corner from whence he came>

 

[Mort]

I know you asked for feats, but check out the prestige classes in the new Dragon (#303).
There is one called the “Reaping Mauler” that is specifically geared for wrestling (for example the first ability he gets is improved grapple – which allows him to start a grapple as a free action with no AoO, after any unarmed strike).

 

[LGodamus]

You also may want to check into Oriental Adventures...lots of feats in there too.

 

[drdevoid]

I know you asked for feats, but check out the prestige classes in the new Dragon

Thanks, Mort. PrCs are definately cool, but I'd have to get everything I need in 2 levels or so. I'm not opposed to that at all. Really, what I need are suggestions on best buys in general. This is only going to be for one or two more games until we get back into a more serious mode.

BTW, Does anybody have MotW? What exactly does Clever Wrestling do? It somehow eschews size differences but I haven't seen my MotW since I lent it in July.

Anyway, as tempting as a straight Barbarian is, I'm thinking I'll have to go with a lot of fighter. A human Ftr 6 has 8 feats. That's most of my list (although really half, since I failed to list all prereqs.) This is kind of where I need help. If it seems I only need 3 or 4, I'd definately take a few Barbarian levels, or go Half-Orc. Wow! I feel stronger already. And you know what they say about once you go Half-Orc.

So many options . . . brain can't function . . . must get ENBoard's support.

 

[drdevoid]

Here's a question for you- is the take down implied in a pin during a grapple. Is there any benefit in taking Improved Trip then?

Well, anyway, I got some amazing rolls (we're supposed to for this game) and after pouring over the stuff I have I tried on this for size. I think this guy could wrestle with bears. Hell, if he's a half-orc I may name him that. What do you think:

As Half-Orc (Brb1, Ftr5)

Wrestles-with-Bears

Str 20 (+5)- raging 24 (+7)
Dex 14 (+2)
Con 14 (+2)- raging 18 (+4)
Int 10 (+0)
Wis 12 (+1)
Cha 12 (+1)

Improved Unarmed Strike (CL: 1st)
Improved Grapple (Ftr Bonus CL: 2nd)
Power Attack (Ftr Bonus CL: 3rd)
Close Quarters Fighting (CL: 3rd)
Improved Bull Rush (Ftr Bonus CL: 5th)
Clever Wrestling (CL: 6th)

OR as Human

Thorin Blackblood (Brb1, Ftr5)

Str 18 (+4)- raging 22 (+6)
Dex 14 (+2)
Con 14 (+2)- raging 18 (+4)
Int 12 (+1)
Wis 12 (+1)
Cha 14 (+2)

Improved Unarmed Strike (CL: 1st)
Improved Grapple (Racial Bonus CL: 1st)
Power Attack (Ftr Bonus CL: 2nd)
Improved Bull Rush (Ftr Bonus CL: 3rd)
Close Quarters Fighting (CL: 3rd)
Expert Tatician (Ftr Bonus CL: 5th)
Clever Wrestling (CL: 6th)

Any other opinions? I'm leaning towards the human version as it stands. Am I missing something really big? Is Expertise and Improved Trip worth it? I like how Combat Reflexes or Expert Tactician works with the wrestling motif. Other feats? I still need to check out OA.

What's the opinion on skills- should I bother with Escape Artist as a cross class?

 

[Kilmore]

If wrestling as a professional, whether in ancient times or modern, it might not be a bad idea to take a few levels in Perform: Wrestling or Perform: Crowd Working. These skills were most noteworthy in the Roman arenas and in modern auditoriums and on TV. It's a DM call on how pertinent would be in the campaign.

 

[Dr. Strangemonkey]

There's PC in my campaign who grapples everything...

...very aggravating and only hidesouly effective because everybody else keeps the other baddies off of him.

The character is a dwarf-still medium sized- with levels in rogue, barbarian, and drunken master.

Really fun character and scary good in combat.

Armor spikes are a definite necessity for anyone who's going grappling. As are levels of tumble and uncanny dodge.

The drunken master really works well with grappling what with improved strength and constitution, movement, and defense against AoO.

 

[Dremen]

Start out with a base of Monk and the Improved Grapple feat (Lets you make a grapple check w/o provoking AoO)

The reason is Monks do more damage than any other class unarmed. It starts at d6. and goes up. Plus this damage is real not subdual.

If you use the monk as described in OA you can change out your feat based bonuses (Stunning Fist, Deflect Arrows, Improved Trip) for other martial art feats.

Then you should get Choke Hold - If you maintain a pin for 1 round your target makes a save. If they fail they are unconcious for 1d3 rounds.

Then take improved Cou De Gra lets you mak a CdG as a standard or MEA action (no book in front of me) Real nice combo.

Then take Earths Embrace. If forget the specifics but you inclict critical damage when grappling.

When you make the character put your scores in this order:

STR, WIS, CON, INT, DEX, CHA
The biggest failing of Monks is most people put the DEX as teh highest score. You have to blow a feat on Weapon Finesse Unarmed Attacks to be able to hit anything, and you don't get a damage bonus. Plus it tends to be easier to raise DEX with magic than STR.

WIS is next most important because you can only loose the AC bounus for this if you are imobilized. DEX ac bonus is easier to loose.

CON as monks only have a d8.

INT Pump up your Tumble and Excape Artist skills as high as they go. The monks have a great skill set.

DEX you just don't want a penalty. Is not as important as the other abilities.

CHA The only throw away stat for monks.

I'd go 1/2 Orc.

After you get your Unarmed Damage up to a d8, I'd multi into fighter. It will increase your HP and your BAB. Plus lets you take other good feats. Or become Chaotic and take levels of Barbarian for the uncanny dodge. You keep all your monk abilities. I would not multi into rogue as your BAB and HP will suffer too much.

Other feats when you can get them would be Improved critical Unarmed Attacks, and then work on some that the previous posters mentioned.

-D