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Rate WotC as a company
- Thread starter Kzach
- Start date
Midnight Dawns
First Post
3/4
The physical quality of the DnD products bothers me. KotS is a big example of this. Then there are things like the characters sheets and the online segment of 4ed. The minis have horrible paint jobs. There is also the issue of the GSL. That said as far as I can tell, there other products seem to be fine. Over all it seems pretty average, which is sad to me because I remember them as being really great when I was a Magic player.
The physical quality of the DnD products bothers me. KotS is a big example of this. Then there are things like the characters sheets and the online segment of 4ed. The minis have horrible paint jobs. There is also the issue of the GSL. That said as far as I can tell, there other products seem to be fine. Over all it seems pretty average, which is sad to me because I remember them as being really great when I was a Magic player.
Styracosaurus
Explorer
I'd say "3".
I like 4e as a game system and that is the most important issue for me.
I like the rapid response on errata. It is unrealistic to expect no bugs in a new system and WotC seems to listen to the fanbase.
Inexpensive mini's are always welcome, especially with the high quality of Dungeon tiles available.
On the other hand,
The loss of Dragon is terrible. On-line content is not a replacement for a print magazine. I'm not participating in the on-line version, although I have little hope for a revival of the magazine.
They need to focus on small goals and accomplish them. DDI is way too big for them to finish. They just need to get us a reliable character generator that can be updated. The virtual tabletop should be put on the shelf.
Ultimately, I think D&D is a print game for a table top. WoW beats out DDI even if they finished DDI. If WotC and 4e fail, it will be over the fact that they dedicated a bunch of resources towards building an inferior concept for a customer base that was not going to use it anyway.
As Joe pointed out, the reuse of art is taboo in game books. For it to be in the core books is heresy.
The increase in prices are something to be expected.
I like 4e as a game system and that is the most important issue for me.
I like the rapid response on errata. It is unrealistic to expect no bugs in a new system and WotC seems to listen to the fanbase.
Inexpensive mini's are always welcome, especially with the high quality of Dungeon tiles available.
On the other hand,
The loss of Dragon is terrible. On-line content is not a replacement for a print magazine. I'm not participating in the on-line version, although I have little hope for a revival of the magazine.
They need to focus on small goals and accomplish them. DDI is way too big for them to finish. They just need to get us a reliable character generator that can be updated. The virtual tabletop should be put on the shelf.
Ultimately, I think D&D is a print game for a table top. WoW beats out DDI even if they finished DDI. If WotC and 4e fail, it will be over the fact that they dedicated a bunch of resources towards building an inferior concept for a customer base that was not going to use it anyway.
As Joe pointed out, the reuse of art is taboo in game books. For it to be in the core books is heresy.
The increase in prices are something to be expected.
Last edited:
Brown Jenkin
First Post
Up until this week even though I have disagreed with the choices and direction of the company I would have given them a 3 or 4. I bought into all thier excuses and explanations. With the release though of the Character Sheet ripoff product I have lost all respect for the company and voted a 2. It would have been a 1 just for the RPG branch but the Magic branch is still propping it up somewhat. I can see no excuse for the Character Sheets other than as a blatant ripoff of thier customers.
Fifth Element
Legend
I give Cadfan a 6 on principle.
JoeGKushner
Adventurer
I don't necessarily see it as complete taboo. Wayne Reynolds had some, what I'd call clip art in the first round of the 3.0 books and it was basically space holders.
Reuse of art in the more expensive core books? That's where I'd call the 'taboo' part, at least for a company of WoTC size. It ain't like this is JK Publishing or something.
You know, I rated them a 3, but not for all the reasons some might think. Outside of their RPG division, I have had nothing but positive experience with WotC.
Recently I bought a copy of Heroscape Master Set 2. I discovered that one of the figures was missing. I called them up (WotC handles HS now) and the guy was friendly, figured out exactly what figure I was missing, and set it up for me to receive it. He then asked how I liked the game, we traded stories about our experiences with it, and he really showed his enthusiasm for the game. That rates WotC extremely high in my book. I had similar experience in the past whenever I called their CS line about board games or non-collectible card games.
The RPG division has been a bit of a letdown. I am not keen on the latest edition of D&D, nor am I thrilled with the marketing of it. The books look okay, but it appears that editing is not the highest quality. The character sheet fiasco, the pdf disaster, the nightmare which is the GSL (as a writer/editor for a small game company, this is a big deal), the DDI (or lack there of), all seem like they are coming from a company set to drive a wedge between it and its former fanbase.
That is what lowered my rating of either a 4 or 5 down to a 3. Wish I could rate them higher based on my non-RPG experience, but that is how I see it.
Recently I bought a copy of Heroscape Master Set 2. I discovered that one of the figures was missing. I called them up (WotC handles HS now) and the guy was friendly, figured out exactly what figure I was missing, and set it up for me to receive it. He then asked how I liked the game, we traded stories about our experiences with it, and he really showed his enthusiasm for the game. That rates WotC extremely high in my book. I had similar experience in the past whenever I called their CS line about board games or non-collectible card games.
The RPG division has been a bit of a letdown. I am not keen on the latest edition of D&D, nor am I thrilled with the marketing of it. The books look okay, but it appears that editing is not the highest quality. The character sheet fiasco, the pdf disaster, the nightmare which is the GSL (as a writer/editor for a small game company, this is a big deal), the DDI (or lack there of), all seem like they are coming from a company set to drive a wedge between it and its former fanbase.
That is what lowered my rating of either a 4 or 5 down to a 3. Wish I could rate them higher based on my non-RPG experience, but that is how I see it.
Dragon Snack
First Post
I voted before reading the thread, I apparently gave them a generous 2...
I don't like the new edition, I'm not happy with the GSL (but for different reasons than most), I haven't bought DDM in over a year (and haven't bought cases since WotDQ), I don't play Magic, IMO they don't put out enough for Star Wars (few books and the minis recycle too many of the main characters), and I haven't bought any of the "new" Axis and Allies or other Avalon Hill stuff (and I am a big fan of the original A&A).
My view of them as a company gets them that rating. They had a successful release of D&D and Magic (although I've heard rumblings of discontent) is still going strong. I haven't bought anything from them since Dungeon Tiles IV (discounting the Chainmail minis I picked up from the bargain bin for $1/piece) and even before that my purchases were few and far between - but they are still selling lots of stuff to lots of people.
That said, if they don't move their butts (to put it mildly) on the DDI then a big selling point of 4.0 will be an utter failure. The GSL as it stands shows me they have concerns about competition - there must be some reason (and that doesn't bode well for the long term outlook). If the quality of the DDM sculpts/paintjobs doesn't get back to where it was then the sales inevitably will drop off (since new competitors are entering the market). That leaves Magic, which has served them well - hence the 2. Not horrible, but with a big (possible) downside. I had forgotten about Heroscape though (but I'm still not sure it would have effected my vote).
If I actually liked 4.0 I may have had an even worse view of them, but since I'm not spending my money on them the reused art/maps and overall lower quality of the books didn't register with me...
I don't like the new edition, I'm not happy with the GSL (but for different reasons than most), I haven't bought DDM in over a year (and haven't bought cases since WotDQ), I don't play Magic, IMO they don't put out enough for Star Wars (few books and the minis recycle too many of the main characters), and I haven't bought any of the "new" Axis and Allies or other Avalon Hill stuff (and I am a big fan of the original A&A).
My view of them as a company gets them that rating. They had a successful release of D&D and Magic (although I've heard rumblings of discontent) is still going strong. I haven't bought anything from them since Dungeon Tiles IV (discounting the Chainmail minis I picked up from the bargain bin for $1/piece) and even before that my purchases were few and far between - but they are still selling lots of stuff to lots of people.
That said, if they don't move their butts (to put it mildly) on the DDI then a big selling point of 4.0 will be an utter failure. The GSL as it stands shows me they have concerns about competition - there must be some reason (and that doesn't bode well for the long term outlook). If the quality of the DDM sculpts/paintjobs doesn't get back to where it was then the sales inevitably will drop off (since new competitors are entering the market). That leaves Magic, which has served them well - hence the 2. Not horrible, but with a big (possible) downside. I had forgotten about Heroscape though (but I'm still not sure it would have effected my vote).
If I actually liked 4.0 I may have had an even worse view of them, but since I'm not spending my money on them the reused art/maps and overall lower quality of the books didn't register with me...
keterys
First Post
I sorta wonder if this poll should have been just about the WotC D&D RPG side of things.
Cause pretty bluntly, D&D is just a minor part of what WotC does. They've got Magic the Gathering, Maple Story, D&D Minis, Star Wars Minis, Axis and Allies Minis, Avalon Hill, various board and card games, tons of other games that have come and gone (Dreamblade, etc), books, etc.
So, I can't speak on a few of those product lines due to sheer inexperience: I really like 4e. It has some bumps, of course, but I'm extremely happy with how things are moving for D&D as a ruleset.
I really like D&D tiles. I mean, this is a seriously awesome product.
I'm a bit worried about the printing quality of their book products (smudged ink, flimsy paper, etc).
I'm pretty unhappy with the trend in D&D Minis of late, but I really love the product itself. If they can restore the average quality to where it was a few sets ago, I'll continue spending quite a lot of cash on them.
I really like the Gleemax Game Table - and I think I'll be buying some of the games I've played on there. Check out Vegas Showdown or Robo Rally if you haven't, though.
The Gleemax Blogs are in a sad, sorry shape. I wish I knew what their actual plans were for this product. I think it's mostly suffered from neglect - it absolutely needed resources and it didn't get them because it wasn't a high enough priority (and I can't fault that evaluation). Will it someday? Who knows. It's actually gotten a lot of bug fixes, but only after scaring away 90% of its traffic.
Their forums and website in general are in a pretty scary shape. They're actually very actively working on this, but in the meantime things are unstable. There are aspects of D&DI that I'm almost positive are purely waiting on the upgrade to a new website infrastructure before they can go up in any usable fashion.
D&DI being late is hardly something to mark the company down for. I mean, if they were charging money, sure - but at the moment they're just not putting out something we didn't have before. Oh well.
I know this next statement is a bit blasphemous... but I like the new Dragon better. It may be in part because of the new system shinies, but quite bluntly I was about to let my subscription to Dragon end when Paizo announced that Dragon was dying. I wasn't finding it useful enough for me and I literally had multiple issues unread. I'm checking wotc's website regularly for new updates to Dragon and I read them at work. I snapshot cut out sections to make handouts or monster sheets for adventures. I love getting playtest classes and such months and months before the books come out. Etc.
If WotC delivers the online game table that I saw with an easily usable interface with the preloaded adventures they've talked about (published modules, Dungeon, RPGA)... then I'll be ecstatic. I will _cheerfully_ hand over money, because that will be an invaluable resource for me to use for online and tabletop play. Period. If they don't, I don't lose anything so I can't really mark them down.
Personally, I've been extremely happy with everyone at WotC that I've personally dealt with. They've been people I would like to call friend and can respect. After discussions with Mike Mearls, Jonathan Tweet, Jennifer Paige, Mike Lescault, and others - I really wish I were out there in Seattle and could actually just play games with these people. I'm hoping that in online play I can. After reading posts from some of the higher up folks like Ken Troop, I can empathize with the problems they're facing. It makes me sad to see how much some of the _people_ get attacked out here on the net.
Anyhow, I'm not going to vote. As someone who has volunteered for a while for WotC, I feel too close to the discussion (or bought), but I do think that some of the extreme votes are really not being very honest with this poll. Not surprising, though.
Cause pretty bluntly, D&D is just a minor part of what WotC does. They've got Magic the Gathering, Maple Story, D&D Minis, Star Wars Minis, Axis and Allies Minis, Avalon Hill, various board and card games, tons of other games that have come and gone (Dreamblade, etc), books, etc.
So, I can't speak on a few of those product lines due to sheer inexperience: I really like 4e. It has some bumps, of course, but I'm extremely happy with how things are moving for D&D as a ruleset.
I really like D&D tiles. I mean, this is a seriously awesome product.
I'm a bit worried about the printing quality of their book products (smudged ink, flimsy paper, etc).
I'm pretty unhappy with the trend in D&D Minis of late, but I really love the product itself. If they can restore the average quality to where it was a few sets ago, I'll continue spending quite a lot of cash on them.
I really like the Gleemax Game Table - and I think I'll be buying some of the games I've played on there. Check out Vegas Showdown or Robo Rally if you haven't, though.
The Gleemax Blogs are in a sad, sorry shape. I wish I knew what their actual plans were for this product. I think it's mostly suffered from neglect - it absolutely needed resources and it didn't get them because it wasn't a high enough priority (and I can't fault that evaluation). Will it someday? Who knows. It's actually gotten a lot of bug fixes, but only after scaring away 90% of its traffic.
Their forums and website in general are in a pretty scary shape. They're actually very actively working on this, but in the meantime things are unstable. There are aspects of D&DI that I'm almost positive are purely waiting on the upgrade to a new website infrastructure before they can go up in any usable fashion.
D&DI being late is hardly something to mark the company down for. I mean, if they were charging money, sure - but at the moment they're just not putting out something we didn't have before. Oh well.
I know this next statement is a bit blasphemous... but I like the new Dragon better. It may be in part because of the new system shinies, but quite bluntly I was about to let my subscription to Dragon end when Paizo announced that Dragon was dying. I wasn't finding it useful enough for me and I literally had multiple issues unread. I'm checking wotc's website regularly for new updates to Dragon and I read them at work. I snapshot cut out sections to make handouts or monster sheets for adventures. I love getting playtest classes and such months and months before the books come out. Etc.
If WotC delivers the online game table that I saw with an easily usable interface with the preloaded adventures they've talked about (published modules, Dungeon, RPGA)... then I'll be ecstatic. I will _cheerfully_ hand over money, because that will be an invaluable resource for me to use for online and tabletop play. Period. If they don't, I don't lose anything so I can't really mark them down.
Personally, I've been extremely happy with everyone at WotC that I've personally dealt with. They've been people I would like to call friend and can respect. After discussions with Mike Mearls, Jonathan Tweet, Jennifer Paige, Mike Lescault, and others - I really wish I were out there in Seattle and could actually just play games with these people. I'm hoping that in online play I can. After reading posts from some of the higher up folks like Ken Troop, I can empathize with the problems they're facing. It makes me sad to see how much some of the _people_ get attacked out here on the net.
Anyhow, I'm not going to vote. As someone who has volunteered for a while for WotC, I feel too close to the discussion (or bought), but I do think that some of the extreme votes are really not being very honest with this poll. Not surprising, though.
The Black Kestrel
Explorer
I gave them a 2/6. I'm basing my rating off of my experience as a long-term RPG customer of WoTC. I was tempted to rate them lower, but the Saga rules for Star Wars was enough to save them from a one or zero. My complaints include:
poor editing
poor support for existing lines (d20 Modern anyone?)
declining product quality since 2005
the cancellation of Dragon and Dungeon in a physical format
the fiasco of the online Dragon and Dungeon magazines
insulting marketing for 4e
poor editing
poor support for existing lines (d20 Modern anyone?)
declining product quality since 2005
the cancellation of Dragon and Dungeon in a physical format
the fiasco of the online Dragon and Dungeon magazines
insulting marketing for 4e
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