Re-use of Non-SRD OGL content?

[Psion]

You misunderstand me, Psion. I'm not arguing against their right to introduce their own material as open content - I was simply suprised that the signature mechanic of Call of Cthulhu would be exported to open source by a company other than Chaosium. Since the CoC D20 had been a one-book deal, I had not expected the Sanity rules to show up again, especially since they had been unchanged from the original BRP rules. But that may very well have been part of the contract for CoC D20.

Two things,

First, as you imply, we aren't privvy to the nature of the agreement between the two. WotC may own all non-mythos laden text lock, stock, and barrel.

Second, the sanity mechanic, though it bears a strong resemblance to that in BRP, is not the same, and likely does not copy any text verbatim (though I have no copy of CoC BRP currently to verify this.)

 

[Voadam]

A couple companies used the ritual system from Relics and Rituals (Green Ronin in Witch's Handbook, Maladin's gate in St. John's College of Abjuration). Necromancer uses some creature collection monsters in some of their modules. ST Cooley said he used a bunch of OGC in one of his modules and the librum equitis dark bard prc in his own bard book. I know Bastion used a Tome of Horrors critter in their Oathbound odds and ends book (I forget the name).

Malhavok and the World of Warcraft list monsters from the Creature collections and tome of horrors and other SSS monster books that would be appropriate in the WoW and the Diamond Throne.

 

[Henry]

Second, the sanity mechanic, though it bears a strong resemblance to that in BRP, is not the same, and likely does not copy any text verbatim (though I have no copy of CoC BRP currently to verify this.)

Ironically, I wonder if WotC reproduced those under the "you can't copyright a rule, only its expression" reasoning? Technically, it does hold legal water, that we know of...

 

[DMH]

MEG had a rule for its Foul Locals series that the authors had to use OGC in a % of the book.

Bastion's Pale Designs had a collection of OGC poisons, Arms and Armor (original and 3.5) is a collection of OGC and each Oathbound supplement has some OGC. Voadam, are you thinking of their Legacies pdf? The only Oathbound books are Domains of the Forge, Plains of Penance, Wrack & Ruin, Arena, Mysteries of Arena and Wildwood. I can't think of any "odds and ends book".

There are 3 totally open settings: Second World Simulation, SpirosBlaak and Murchad's Legacy. I have yet to see another company write supplements for any of them. Sad really since all 3 have a lot to offer new authors.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

There are 3 totally open settings: Second World Simulation, SpirosBlaak and Murchad's Legacy. I have yet to see another company write supplements for any of them. Sad really since all 3 have a lot to offer new authors.

Incidentaly, I'm thinking about turning ML into a Wiki to help generate material.

That would mean I'd have to give it away for free, but frankly the finanical hit I took on that product was so large that any hopes of further revenue are as dead as a dead cow.

 

[Napftor]

MEG had a rule for its Foul Locals series that the authors had to use OGC in a % of the book...

Not so. It may have looked that way (I know myself and Charles Plemmons used OGC) but there was no rule to this effect.

Using other publishers' OGC is something I endorse wholeheartedly. As mentioned, why reinvent the wheel? Two of my recent books--Dread Codex and Temporality--utilize a great deal of open content that was then tweaked to fit the books' styles/subjects. Easier on me and it gives folks yet another chance to see the great stuff that's already out there.

 

[jmucchiello]

There are several reasons not to reuse 3rd party OGC. Some of them good, some of them not-so-good. But all of them taken together can be a reason not to do it.

1) There is no way to know that the OGC in the 3rd party book is licensed correctly. Or that the 3rd party has sufficient rights to put the material under OGC.

2) Some OGC is hard to identify as OGC and so while you might enjoy using such-and-such a rule from some book, that doesn't mean its OGC can easily be reused.

3) Reprinting OGC is a dual-edged sword. It takes up space in the book. Some people will have the source material and will feel they are paying for the same material twice if you reprint the OGC. Others won't have access to the original and if you don't reprint it, the new stuff is unusable. You can't please both camps so what do you do?

As a corellary to this, if you don't republish, the only people buying your product and using it fully are the 800 people who bought the other product. So instead having a small market for your product you now only have a tiny market (diminutive market?).

4) Ego. Most 3rd party pubs became 3rd party pubs so they could publish "their stuff". Reusing someone else's stuff is counter-indicitive of the personality type. Then there's the whole, "this is good but my way would make it better" problem

5) The license makes it difficult to say stuff like "Compatible with Ritual rules from Necromancer Games' Relics and Rituals". So even if you are proud to be compatible with older rules, you need to arrange licenses with the creators to say so. This legal hurdle is usually not difficult, but over time, it could turn into a big legal licensing file you have to maintain to ensure your compliance all around.

I'm hoping that now that the D20 market is slowing down on what "needs" to be done, companies will stop trying to rush out and be the first with a set of rules for doing something...

Um, nothing "needs" to be done at all. And eventually RPG customers learn this and stop buying. You really only need the core 3 books to play D&D for decades. Everything else is just icing.

 

[DMH]

Not so. It may have looked that way (I know myself and Charles Plemmons used OGC) but there was no rule to this effect.

Funny, since it was a comment you made either here or at rpg.net that indicated to me there was a requirement.

 

[Napftor]

Funny, since it was a comment you made either here or at rpg.net that indicated to me there was a requirement.

I must have sniffed too many cleaning fluids that day.

 

[jgbrowning]

In this smaller, leaner market, have the D20 publishers started borrowing the best of each other's work?

We did this with the Monster Geographica series that Biggus mentioned and we've done (or will do) some more with smaller PDFs, but I generally try to avoid using other's OGC material out of courtesy. When I do, I try to not use too much at one time from one location or I try to alter the material enough to where I'm comfortable with re-using it.

joe b.