Reading Group--Caesar's Legion

[Darkness]

Just read the entire thread. Great stuff, folks!

I've always loved Roman history...

Heh. I've even "forced" myself to read Theodor Mommsen's quite dry (but still awesome - it didn't get that nobel prize in literature fer nuthin' ) eight volumes of "A history of Rome."
The German version of it, that is; I always try to read everything in the original language - provided that the language of the original work is either English or German. Or Latin, even though that's not as easy for me...
In fact, my decision to learn Latin was based mostly on my interest in Roman history (besides, the alternative would have been French - and what do I need French for in my everyday life, anyway? ).
I've of course also read Caesar's de bello Gallico (both in German and Latin).

But apart from these books, I haven't yet read too many great books about Rome.
Of course, GURPS Imperial Rome is a great book, too (), and reading all volumes of Asterix - including one in Latin - was also very cool, but still...

So I think that reading Caesar's Legion would be quite thrilling for me.
I'll try to get it; won't be exactly easy here in Austria (and without a credit card or any form of online banking, online ordering is right out, I guess), but I'll set my most trusted book store clerks on it...

 

[mmadsen]

Just read the entire thread. Great stuff, folks!

Danke, Dunkelheit.

I've even "forced" myself to read Theodor Mommsen's quite dry (but still awesome - it didn't get that nobel prize in literature fer nuthin' ) eight volumes of "A history of Rome."

I don't know if I can make time for eight volumes on any one subject. I just keep looking at my growing book pile, and I shudder.

Of course, GURPS Imperial Rome is a great book, too (), and reading all volumes of Asterix - including one in Latin - was also very cool, but still...

That reminds me, I barely read Latin (one summer school course), but my classicist buddy pointed me toward Caesaris Bellum Helveticum: Caesar's Gallic Wars by Karl Heinz Gra Von Rothenburg. It's a comic-book rendition of Caesar's Gallic Wars, in Latin.

 

[mmadsen]

Chapter X -- A Taste of Defeat (continued)

Speaking of trench warfare...

Caesar, as much an engineering genius as a master soldier, then began building a double line of entrenchments right around Pompey's camp. By the time he had finished, the inner line ran for fifteen miles and incorporated twenty-four forts. The outer ine, set back eleven hundred yards, extended for seventeen miles.

 

[Darkness]

...
I don't know if I can make time for eight volumes on any one subject. I just keep looking at my growing book pile, and I shudder. ...

They're novel-sized, on the average, BTW. Plus, they were in German; for some reason, English books are usually somewhat thinner than German ones - probably because English doesn't need so many words to describe things.
Anyway, I agree: Nowadays, I couldn't read 8 books in any reasonable amount of time, either.

 

[mmadsen]

Imagine modern Marines having to dig a fort every day ? The Romans certainly seem to value the use of transport ships in some strategms... but overall they seem very worried, against barbarians at least, about fortifications and defensive posture.

I wouldn't say the Romans were "worried" about fortifications; they simply knew they were very effective. On the modern battlefield, you can't dig in well enough in one night to render yourself virtually immune to attack. In ancient Rome, you could.

 

[jgbrowning]

reading suggestion

I'd pick up John Peddie's "The Roman War Machine"

excellent.

joe b.

 

[mmadsen]

Re: reading suggestion

I'd pick up John Peddie's "The Roman War Machine" excellent.

The few reviews I've seen haven't been particularly positive. What did you like about it?

 

[mmadsen]

Chapter X -- A Taste of Defeat (continued)

...residents of Durres stole out of the city and found their way to Caesar, offering to change sides and betray the town to him. They told him to come in the dead of night to one of the city gates, the one near the shrine of Artemis, which was apparently outside the city walls, bringing a small number of picked men. Then, just before dawn, they would open the gates to him so he could seize the city.

Anyone else's spider sense tingling? It certainly sounds like a scene we could steal for a D&D scenario though!

Here at daybreak, as Caesar approached the gate by the temple of Artemis, Pompey sprung a trap. Caesar's cavalry were ambushed in the lanes by waiting troops, and they had to fight desperately to make their escape, with Caesar himself only just evading capture.

He really was lucky -- for awhile there.

 

[mmadsen]

Chapter X -- A Taste of Defeat (continued)

I can certainly see PCs leading this assault force:

It had been a moonlit night, but aided by thick clouds that shrouded the moon, the assault force had crept unseen across no-man's-land and quietly filled in parts of the trenches skirting the fortified wall of the 8th Legion fort. As dawn broke, the spearhead troops surged across the trench, paving the way for archers, who set about raining arrows into the fort.

A few gruesome stats:

But he [Caesar] does admit that every survivor was wounded -- some 250 to 300 men -- with 4 centurions of the 8th Legion cohort losing eyes to arrows.

Amond the wounded...was the fort's commander, Colonel Minucius, who also lost an eye and received five additional wounds. When Caesar arrrived back from Durres he was shown the shield of Cassius Scaevus, a junior centurion of the 8th grade who'd taken over command of the fort after Colonel Minucius and the four other more senior centurions were wounded. If we can believe it, the had been punctured 120 times in the fight.

I can just imagine arrows deflecting off shields and armor until eventually one finds an opening -- right between the top of the shield and the rim of the helmet.

Caesar also claims that his men collected thirty thousand Pompeian arrows that had been fired into the fort. Centurion Scaevus was promoted to the first rank and received a bonus of two hundred thousand sesterces, a fortune for an enlisted man. All the other survivors of the cohort were later given duplicarius status -- their wages were doubled -- and received extra food and clothing allowances.

At least the hazard pay's good.

 

[jgbrowning]

Re: Re: reading suggestion

The few reviews I've seen haven't been particularly positive. What did you like about it?

dont have time for afull response right now, but one of the most useful things in the book is the diagram showing how it took 6 (8)? legions cant remember off the top of my head 16 hours to go 10 miles.

excellent information on logistics and engenering.

try to respond with more later,

joe b.