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[renau1g]

The only specific complaint that I have about moderation is that the current system sometimes seems to reward deliberate trolls and punish well-meaning community members trying to police their own backyard.

I'm curious what you mean ?

If I see a post I think violates the rules I just report it and keep going.

 

[john112364]

I think the moderators do a good job in a difficult situation. Moderation can be very subjective sometimes, but the mods here (IMHO) seem pretty consistant. And while I've seen the +5 ban hammer wielded with authority on this site, it seems to be the last resort rather than the first (as I've seen in some other sites). This is one of the best moderated sites I've visited.

My 2cp.

 

[jdrakeh]

I'm curious what you mean ?

If I see a post I think violates the rules I just report it and keep going.

If I wasn't posting from my iPad, I'd search you out specific examples but, basically, the problem is this:

Being a deliberate a-hole with regard to edition war trolling isn't explicitly against the rules, so you get a lot of people who exploit that loophole to be the biggest a-hole that they possibly can be, deliberately.

When no moderator action is taken despite such a poster being reported multiple times, by multiple parties, a well-meaning but misguided poster (or three) inevitably steps in and calls a spade a spade, identifying the troll as such and telling them to bugger off.

The bad news is that calling another poster out like that, no matter how deserved, pretty much *is* against the rules. This results in the person or persons who were baited by the troll being admonished while, often, the troll is left to continue indulging his offensive behavior unabated.

Now, granted, I'm not saying that this happens *all* of the time, but it does happen a *lot* (or did, at any rate). Or it happens enough that I have heard other people frequently cite it as an issue with moderation here.

 

[racoffin]

Being a deliberate a-hole with regard to edition war trolling isn't explicitly against the rules, so you get a lot of people who exploit that loophole to be the biggest a-hole that they possibly can be, deliberately.

When no moderator action is taken despite such a poster being reported multiple times, by multiple parties, a well-meaning but misguided poster (or three) inevitably steps in and calls a spade a spade, identifying the troll as such and telling them to bugger off.

The bad news is that calling another poster out like that, no matter how deserved, pretty much *is* against the rules. This results in the person or persons who were baited by the troll being admonished while, often, the troll is left to continue indulging his offensive behavior unabated.

Now, granted, I'm not saying that this happens *all* of the time, but it does happen a *lot* (or did, at any rate). Or it happens enough that I have heard other people frequently cite it as an issue with moderation here.

This seems to be something you see a lot, and one of the things that drove me away from the forums for quite a bit. Looking over the last few weeks, for example, you can watch the same people having the same "discussions" and derailing conversations for tens of pages to prove their point. The thinly (and not so thinly) veiled edition wars get old. I imagine the mods get tired of repeating the same warnings to only have them ignored time and again.

As an aside, thank you for taking the time to do so regardless. It is appreciated by those of us who'd like to see conversation without attacks.

 

[TarionzCousin]

IMHO, this is the best moderated site out there. The mods here work hard and do a great job of keeping things free but under control--and the only payment they have ever received was watching Gary Gygax kill Rel's character's mule.

However, I do miss some of the banned posters of yesteryear....

 

[Umbran]

If I wasn't posting from my iPad, I'd search you out specific examples

See above about specific examples.

Being a deliberate a-hole with regard to edition war trolling isn't explicitly against the rules, so you get a lot of people who exploit that loophole to be the biggest a-hole that they possibly can be, deliberately.

You know how we always tell you folks to address the post, not the poster, and to not ascribe motives? We try to practice what we preach as much as our jobs allow.

So, you may see a person and think they are deliberately being a jerk. We'd be wrong to act as quickly as you think of it. So, we look at the post and see that they are mentioning a topic, but otherwise is within the rules (for example, they aren't insulting people). We avoid taking the step of deciding it was deliberate jerkitude as long as we can - because we are only human, and we feel missing a few cases for a while is better than being harsh on someone who didn't mean any harm.

Ultimately, we expect all of you to have the presence of mind, wisdom, and self-control to not feed trolls, and to walk away from conversations you feel are not constructive.

If you admit to yourself that you don't have the ability to do that, try using the Ignore list! It is there precisely for that purpose. We know you're human, too, so we give you some tools to help you.

When no moderator action is taken despite such a poster being reported multiple times, by multiple parties...

This probably happens less often than you think these days. Multiple reports by multiple people are pretty rare.

 

[jdrakeh]

See above about specific examples.

Ah, I missed that.

You know how we always tell you folks to address the post, not the poster, and to not ascribe motives? We try to practice what we preach as much as our jobs allow.

Sorry, but that rings pretty hollow. In the past I have seen posters who brazenly admitted that they were trolling get a free pass (in some cases, many free passes) and those that criticized such behavior get shut own.

I assume this occurred for the reasons I mention earlier (I.e., edition war trolling not being explicitly against the rules and attacking other posters being very much against them), but this doesn't make the pill any easier to swallow for a lot of folks.

Ultimately, we expect all of you to have the presence of mind, wisdom, and self-control to not feed trolls, and to walk away from conversations you feel are not constructive.

See, I read this as an admission of recognizing problem behavior but opting not to moderate it and, instead, placing the onus on other users to deal with it (or not, as the case may be). Which is, in a nutshell, the heart of the issue that I outlined.

This probably happens less often than you think these days. Multiple reports by multiple people are pretty rare.

I can't speak for others, but I've been conditioned not to report things anymore, as it rarely seems to do any good.

 

[jdrakeh]

Just so I am not entirely negative, I do perceive the above as less of an issue than I did a year ago (when it was bad enough that I started posting primarily at CM and RPGnet). So, thanks for that.

 

[the Jester]

ENWorld is a huge site, and I think the moderation here generally varies from 'good' to 'great', with some exceptions.

There are bad instances- heck, there are periods when the moderation level seems to crap up for a week or two- but generally, especially considering how big of a site this place is, I think it's pretty good.

I've taken to reporting b-holes when I notice them, and while I'm not generally aware of the moderation that takes place- I assume often via PM or whatever- I sometimes notice it get addressed. My suspicion is that it's actually addressed a good deal more than I actually notice.

So in short, while far from perfect, I think the moderation here is probably about as good as you can get, all things considered.

 

[Rel]

IMHO, this is the best moderated site out there. The mods here work hard and do a great job of keeping things free but under control--and the only payment they have ever received was watching Gary Gygax kill Rel's character's mule.

However, I do miss some of the banned posters of yesteryear....

It was Piratecat's mule, not mine. I was smart enough to buy a dungeon cart!