D&D General Rerolling Initiative each Round

[Sword of Spirit]

I've considered using it, but haven't tried it. I think it would probably end up feeling like the trade off isn't worth it at my table.

What I would never consider though is going back to action declaration rounds and/or weapon/spell speeds. I was a bit skeptical when 3e got rid of that in favor of set cyclical initiative, but after playing for only a brief time I never wanted to go back. The whole idea of having to plan ahead of time, and having your speed of activity determined by what you intend to do leading to the complications when your action becomes invalid was just the opposite of fun to me and required just as much suspension of disbelief as cyclical initiate, just in different ways. About the only thing good I can say about it is that declaring actions in reverse order of taking them really makes winning initiative matter since you can plan around the slower combatants. And if younare having a declaration phase and aren't doing it in reverse order you are missing a lot of the point IMO.

 

[Charlaquin]

Hi everybody!

I've been reading some OSR stuff, really enamored by the turn structure for exploration and gearing up to do a hexcrawl and dungeon crawl game. But it's got me thinking about other old rules.

Who has played with rerolling Initiative each round and weapon speeds? It seems like it will drastically slow down games, but it may also feel more tactical. How does it end up changing the way the game is played? How do the players change their play?

I’ve done it, and in my experience there is some slowdown at first, but less than you’d expect, and once everyone gets used to the system, it’s pretty comparable in terms of total table time per combat. What I do is I keep action declarations very simple: declare the action you intend to take, and in the case of an attack or spell, what weapon or spell you intended to use. No need to say where you plan to move or what target you plan to attack. Roll your weapon’s damage die, or 1d4 for each component the spell requires (verbal, somatic, material), or 1d8 for other actions, I roll monsters’ hit die type for them. Lower rolls are better. That keeps the action declaration phase at the top of the round quick. Then start counting up from 1, players say to stop when you reach their number. Player turns tend to go faster because they’ve already made the biggest decision and are just executing it.

 

[LordEntrails]

Been using initiative re-rolling each round for about 5-8 years now in various 5E games. We really like it. In short it add the sense of chaos to combat and prevents metagaming.

Now, admittedly because we use Fantasy Grounds it removes a lot of the administration and their is zero slow down. For us, I think it actually speeds things up because everyone has to "be there" all the time since they never know if they will go first or last on the next turn.

FG also tracks durations, and since we let spells end on the initiative number of when they were cast (which is the default FG behavior). It adds even more chaos to combat since the caster's init is going to change between rounds, something might have already expired by their next turn, or might last longer. We're ok with that.

 

[Charlaquin]

That's an interesting way to do it. I've been wanting to try out this version, though:

1) At start of round, everyone declares action intent in order of lowest to highest initiative bonus

This works. Personally I have players declare actions in order of highest to lowest Wisdom score, and have Dexterity score break ties. I also recommend not having players declare bonus actions during this phase. Just action, and if relevant the weapon or spell they plan to use for that action.

2) Everyone rolls initiative, applying the initiative adjustment for their action (+2 for light weapons, -2 for heavy weapons, -1 per spell level).

I prefer to use different dice (smaller dice for faster weapons/spells, bigger dice for slower), and go lowest to highest instead of rolling a d20 and adding modifiers based on weapon/spell speeds. The reason for this is that it cuts down on arithmetic, which can slow down the process, and if your initiative count is just the number rolled on a die, players can keep that number facing up so there’s no risk of forgetting their initiative.

3) Turns proceed from highest to lowest initiative. If your action is nullified, there are basic actions you can choose to do instead.

Yep, dodge, disengage, and dash are popular options for “default actions” you can take if your action becomes impossible to take. Personally, I favor Ready for this purpose. That way you basically get a second opportunity to make an attack or cast a spell, but at the cost of your reaction.

4) (based on my last reply) End of round, end certain effects (tick down round count on durations).

My rule is that any effect that would normally happen at the start or end of a creature’s turn (including short-duration effects expiring) instead happen at the start or end of the round on which that creature’s turn takes place.

Another option might be for one-round effects to end on the same initiative they started on, on the following round. But then you risk forgetting what count an effect started on.

 

[Zaukrie]

When I use a declare system, if your action is no longer available, you have options:

move only
melee attack someone next to you
move after every enemy in initiative, and do what you want

 

[Guest 7037866]

I'm thinking about returning to @DND_Reborn Cinematic Initiative System or a personal variant of it. I always enjoyed playing in his games with it and I think my group has gotten enough experience to consider it. I'll run it by them probably before the end of the year so we'll see.

 

[Rabbitbait]

I reroll initiative every round, but because I play through Roll20 I just have a simple macro in place to automatically reroll initiative for all combatants at the start of each round. It rewards those with high dex or who build a high init character, it adds a bit more randomness to spell durations and makes everything more fun. I also have each monster with individual initiative as well.

It wouldn't work for every group but it really adds to the fun for us.

 

[Distracted DM]

In my last 2 campaigns we did it.

It actually sped things up because we also implemented a rule to have the players deliberate on their plan at the beginning of the round.

Can you elaborate on that rule to have players talk plan? How do you enforce that, and what did it result in?

 

[Lanefan]

Hi everybody!

I've been reading some OSR stuff, really enamored by the turn structure for exploration and gearing up to do a hexcrawl and dungeon crawl game. But it's got me thinking about other old rules.

Who has played with rerolling Initiative each round and weapon speeds? It seems like it will drastically slow down games, but it may also feel more tactical. How does it end up changing the way the game is played? How do the players change their play?

We've never used weapon speed but we've re-rolled initiatives since forever.

The only real slowdown comes when someone's away from the table at init-rolling time. Otherwise, it forces players to think on their feet as they can't predict what sequence things will happen in and contributes greatly to the "fog of war" where not everyone's actions will always be the most optimal.

We also allow tied or simultaneous initiatives: we resolve them one at a time but it's understood that multiple things are happening at once.

 

[Lanefan]

I've never been a fan of rerolling initiative because:

A) I have a hard enough time tracking initiative at the beginning of combat. To have to do it each round would make things more tedious.

We use d6 for initiative and the players just leave the dice on the table in front of them.

B) Players quickly learn the initiative order and can then plan their next turn before it arrives. Rerolling would make it harder to do that, reducing (or hampering) strategy.

This is exactly what I don't want! They shouldn't be able to plan that far ahead. Combat is chaotic and constantly shifting, re-rolling nicely reflects that.

C) Some abilities last until the beginning or end of your next turn. If you were to go at the end of the 1st round, then the beginning of the 2nd round, your ability might get wasted. Likewise, if you were to go at the beginning of the 1st round, then the end of the 2nd round, your ability might last an overpowered amount of time.

Ah, that does require a change and additional tracking: the ability should last for a round regardless of turn sequence, meaning if it resolves on init 5 this round it expires on 5 next round.

And yes this means sometimes you'll get double benefit out of it and other times you'll get nothing. So be it.