Reworking of Races, Subraces and Existing Campaign Worlds

[Lurks-no-More]

I can totally see them doing that for 4e, too: So Drizzt now has a quick, "surgical strike" fighting style and does some manoeuvres. It's still Drizzt, the guy with two scimitars. Elminster is a 4e Wizard now, and fond of his staff. He's still his old self!

Eladrin are called Sun Elves in the 4e Realms. An Eladrin and an Elf procreating produce a full-bred Eladrin or Elf, not a mix (or maybe they do, if there's a half-eladrin, half-elf race in 4e).

The cosmology is just assumed to be like this, and having always been like this. They did that in 3e, too, and didn't need a RSE for that.

That's the way I'm going to do it, if I'm going to run a 4th edition FR game. 3.* fluff + 4E crunch = profit! (I hope.)

 

[Kae'Yoss]

That's the way I'm going to do it, if I'm going to run a 4th edition FR game. 3.* fluff + 4E crunch = profit! (I hope.)

That's what I'd do if I'd ever have another 4e game. The advantage is that you won't need any 4e FR books for that - and since they'll be useless for that purpose, that's not so bad (And useless they will be)

 

[Roman]

It appears that we have our answer and it is a very positive one:

Actually, I expect that sun elves, moon elves, and star elves would all fall into the description of "eladrin" for game stats, while wood elves and green elves would be "elves." But we're still going to call them sun elves, star elves, etc., for the most part. Nobody in Faerun would call those folks eladrins, they'd call them ar-tel-quessir, sun elves, or gold elves.

Link: http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14197018&postcount=928

 

[Kae'Yoss]

So much for consistency: While they have to tear Toril to pieces to explain how stuff like new Magic works, some races being actually different races now is being handwaved.

If only they had used that approach for all the rules changes.

 

[The Little Raven]

If only they had used that approach for all the rules changes.

This is giving into the FR fans that still want a million <blank> elf races in the game.

 

[Aeolius]

What is a "green elf"?

 

[Stormtalon]

What is a "green elf"?

Seasick.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

What is a "green elf"?

A young one, not yet 30, that doesn't know yet what the other gender's for

To drop into being serious for a spell: Green elf's the other name for wild elves (or was it wood elves? I think wood elves are called copper elves). They get +2dex and -2int. Even more reclusive then wood elves.

And to be honest: While I have no problem with a dozen different elven subraces (or dwarven subraces, or any subraces), the distinction between somewhat wild/woody elves and very wild/woody elves always did seem excessive to me. I can understand having gold/sun elves and moon/silver elves as well as wood elves, plus sea elves and drow. I can even see how star elves make sense, but making wood elves as well as wild elves always seemed a bit like having seawater elves and freshwater elves or something.

 

[FourthBear]

Haven't you seen the lynchmobs that formed after that disaster?

I hated the Avatar Trilogy and the Time of Troubles, but I'd have to say that while there were many complaints, it's not like it appeared to result in negative impact on sales. Lynch mobs there may have been, but the books kept on selling.....

 

[JohnSnow]

And to be honest: While I have no problem with a dozen different elven subraces (or dwarven subraces, or any subraces), the distinction between somewhat wild/woody elves and very wild/woody elves always did seem excessive to me. I can understand having gold/sun elves and moon/silver elves as well as wood elves, plus sea elves and drow. I can even see how star elves make sense, but making wood elves as well as wild elves always seemed a bit like having seawater elves and freshwater elves or something.

Or like having Deep Sea Elves (Dargonesti) and Shoal Elves (Dimernesti) from Dragonlance? Yes, subraces have been done to death!

However, I have to agree with you. A distinction that models High Elves, Wood Elves, Dark Elves and Sea Elves (if you want them) makes sense. And quite honestly, I think 4e's just calling the first three Eladrin, Elf, and Drow for naming purposes. That way, you can avoid silly things like:

Player 1: "What race is your character?"
Player 2: "I'm an elf. I like the benefits I got for going into wizardry."
Player 1: "Elves are nature guys...live in trees...use bows...like Legolas."
Player 2: "Nooo...I'm a HIGH elf. We live in trees but we make great spellcasters. What you're talking about are wood elves."
Player 1: "Bloody elves..."

It amazes me that with so many people ripping on Tolkien-based fantasy, they're clinging desperately to a concept he made up - that elves can be differentiated by subrace. Even the terms Grey, High, Star, and Sylvan are his.

Tolkien's list is a holy mess. But dividing elves into 2 categories (not counting Drow) fits both his work and the common perception of the various subraces in D&D. We can have the woodsy elves, and the secluded mystical eladrin. Why are people getting into such an uproar over terminology?